Question regarding moca or other solution sugestions

[mynameisbryanok]

I recently moved into a basement apartment. The wireless internet has quite a week signal by the time it gets to me. There is a TV downstairs that has a coaxial cable that goes to it. I'm looking for solutions to better my internet connection downstairs without having access to the modem or router upstairs. Would I be able to run the existing coaxial cable to moca adapter and then run Ethernet to a router?

Any suggestions? Thank you

 

[stevech]

Nothing comes close to cat5 cable. Nothing. Run it if you can find any way.

Your only consumer-land options are MoCa, IP over power lines (forum section here), a WiFi repeater a.k.a. range extender (bad alternative).

Yes, a pair of MoCa devices essentially replace a length of cat5 cable, but operate at about 100Mbps raw speed and 70Mbps net yield. A bit slower but good enough.
So one end can connect a MoCA box to a router or ethernet switch and the other MoCa can connect to computers or an ethernet switch. That switch can be built-in on some MoCa products, or as a cheap add-on.
Indeed, you can connect a WiFi Access Point/AP (or a WiFi router configured as an AP to the far end of a MoCa run. The AP creates a new area of WiFi coverage.

3+ MoCa devices can be on the same coax system of splitters.
Really, a MoCa box is much like an Ethernet switch, both being IP-unaware layer 2 devices. They look at packet MAC addresses, not IP addresses (excluding enterprise grade switches).

IP Over power wiring has troubles over time with power line noise and varying attenuation as mains powered things come and go. But these are easier to connect up.

I've got an old pair of D-Link MoCa boxes that have run 24/7 at 70Mbps for years now with no issues.

And, MoCa boxes at retail are harder to find - you'll probably need to find them on Amazon or eBay.

 

[mynameisbryanok]

Nothing comes close to cat5 cable. Nothing. Run it if you can find any way.

Your only consumer-land options are MoCa, IP over power lines (forum section here), a WiFi repeater a.k.a. range extender (bad alternative).

Yes, a pair of MoCa devices essentially replace a length of cat5 cable, but operate at about 100Mbps raw speed and 70Mbps net yield. A bit slower but good enough.
So one end can connect a MoCA box to a router or ethernet switch and the other MoCa can connect to computers or an ethernet switch. That switch can be built-in on some MoCa products, or as a cheap add-on.
Indeed, you can connect a WiFi Access Point/AP (or a WiFi router configured as an AP to the far end of a MoCa run. The AP creates a new area of WiFi coverage.

3+ MoCa devices can be on the same coax system of splitters.
Really, a MoCa box is much like an Ethernet switch, both being IP-unaware layer 2 devices. They look at packet MAC addresses, not IP addresses (excluding enterprise grade switches).

IP Over power wiring has troubles over time with power line noise and varying attenuation as mains powered things come and go. But these are easier to connect up.

I've got an old pair of D-Link MoCa boxes that have run 24/7 at 70Mbps for years now with no issues.

And, MoCa boxes at retail are harder to find - you'll probably need to find them on Amazon or eBay.

So it sounds like I need to have two moca devices one to set up upstairs and one downstairs? because I don't have accesses to the portion of the house that the modem and router are in does this mean I am out of luck? Thanks for your reply.

 

[azazel1024]

Yes, you would need a pair of MoCA bridges. One within distance of the router to run an ethernet cable from the router to the MoCA bridge in to the house/building's Coax. The other one close to your router.

You'd have the same issue with powerline. One option you could do if you cannot physically access the router at all for any reason, is get wireless router that supports wireless bridging. Then get some high gain antennas and point it at the existing router. Like maybe some 12-14dBi panel antennas or 14-18dBi yagis. Then you connect the wireless bridge to your own router. Set the first router up in wireless bridge mode of the router else where providing internet access. Then connect the WAN port on your 2nd router to the LAN port on the router running as a wireless bridge. Set the wireless channel on your 2nd router to something other than what the main network is on and connect your devices to your new wireless network.

A setup like that could easily increase wireless performance/speed by 3-4x if not more, if you have an existing weak signal.

 

[mynameisbryanok]

Yes, you would need a pair of MoCA bridges. One within distance of the router to run an ethernet cable from the router to the MoCA bridge in to the house/building's Coax. The other one close to your router.

You'd have the same issue with powerline. One option you could do if you cannot physically access the router at all for any reason, is get wireless router that supports wireless bridging. Then get some high gain antennas and point it at the existing router. Like maybe some 12-14dBi panel antennas or 14-18dBi yagis. Then you connect the wireless bridge to your own router. Set the first router up in wireless bridge mode of the router else where providing internet access. Then connect the WAN port on your 2nd router to the LAN port on the router running as a wireless bridge. Set the wireless channel on your 2nd router to something other than what the main network is on and connect your devices to your new wireless network.

A setup like that could easily increase wireless performance/speed by 3-4x if not more, if you have an existing weak signal.

This sounds like a great solution thank you. Could you recommend some products that would be suited well for this?

 

[azazel1024]

It would help to know the router that you'd be connecting to. Can you run inSSIDer on a laptop or some other wifi sniffer to find out what the router is? The typical bridging protocol is WDS, and it isn't as standard as one would like, so going cross manufacturer can lead to problems sometimes. Heck, even within the same manufacturer can cause issues sometimes.

That said, what I use for an inexpensive, but very fast, N600 router is a TP-Link WDR3600. I have a couple laying around. Two antennas, nice and fast. New only about $50, used maybe $35.

A couple of these http://www.amazon.com/dp/B003CFATNS/?tag=snbforums-20 or a couple of these http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00DTWTXTK/?tag=snbforums-20 would set you up. I'd be inclined to go with the panel antennas as they'll be a little easier to work with since they aren't as narrow focus.

That said, you can always get the router, play with the shipping antenna orientation and see if you can get a good connection that way. May not need bigger antennas. You could also just get larger dipole, but that may not be as effective.

 

[mynameisbryanok]

It would help to know the router that you'd be connecting to. Can you run inSSIDer on a laptop or some other wifi sniffer to find out what the router is? The typical bridging protocol is WDS, and it isn't as standard as one would like, so going cross manufacturer can lead to problems sometimes. Heck, even within the same manufacturer can cause issues sometimes.

That said, what I use for an inexpensive, but very fast, N600 router is a TP-Link WDR3600. I have a couple laying around. Two antennas, nice and fast. New only about $50, used maybe $35.

A couple of these http://www.amazon.com/dp/B003CFATNS/?tag=snbforums-20 or a couple of these http://www.amazon.com/Super-Power-Supply®-WZR-HP-G450H-WHR-HP-G300N/dp/B00DTWTXTK/ref=sr_1_16?ie=UTF8&qid=1432846376&sr=8-16&keywords=2.4GHz+yagi would set you up. I'd be inclined to go with the panel antennas as they'll be a little easier to work with since they aren't as narrow focus.

That said, you can always get the router, play with the shipping antenna orientation and see if you can get a good connection that way. May not need bigger antennas. You could also just get larger dipole, but that may not be as effective.

Hi I'm not back in my apartment and can access the necessary information. My landlords router is a netgear WGR614v8. They have not changed their default router password so I have access to all the settings. Everything I have read about setting up a wireless bridge seems to indicate that I need physical access to the router I am connecting to, is this true because I don't have physical access to it? What would you recommend I buy?

I have a cheap wireless router of my own a NETGEAR WNR2000 v4 will this be useful?

Thanks for your help

 

[azazel1024]

No, you don't need access to the other router at all. You can probably bridge the WNR2000 to the WGR614v8.

Just go under the settings and look for WDS Bridge and set that up. However, the WNR2000 is a pretty crappy router with crappy internal antennas. I'd look at what I posted above already on a massively better, and not very expensive router to be trying to set this up with.

 

[htismaqe]

You could avoid using WDS if you got a device that supports wireless client mode and then a cheap 5Ghz AP/router (assuming it's a small apartment).

I've got a cheap little ZyXel P-33oW that supports client mode, I think I paid $15 for it. Connect the client bridge to the wireless router upstairs. Then connect one of the LAN ports to the WAN port of the 5Ghz router and connect your wireless clients to the wireless side of it.

You don't have to worry about having physical access to the upstairs router, WDS, compatibility, or even overlapping 2.4Ghz channels.

 

[mynameisbryanok]

Thanks for the reply I'll order the router you recommended and two of the antennas that you also recommended.

 

[azazel1024]

Also, the TP-Link supports OpenWRT which has a wireless client mode last I checked, supposing you run in to compatibility issues with the TP-Link WDR3600 running in WDS mode to the netgear upstairs, with the default firmware.

 

[mynameisbryanok]

Also, the TP-Link supports OpenWRT which has a wireless client mode last I checked, supposing you run in to compatibility issues with the TP-Link WDR3600 running in WDS mode to the netgear upstairs, with the default firmware.

Is that something I can just set up differently in the settings?

 

[azazel1024]

OpenWRT? No, search for it on Google. It is a separate firmware you'd need to download and install. WDS bridging may work just fine.

 

[mynameisbryanok]

OpenWRT? No, search for it on Google. It is a separate firmware you'd need to download and install. WDS bridging may work just fine.

So WDS is built in? and if that does not work I should download the firmware for OpenWRT?

 

[azazel1024]

Correct. TP-Links firmware for the WDR3600 does not have wireless client mode, only WDS. Which may work, but WDS is less standard than most standards, so sometimes it does not work across different manufacturers of routers. Sometimes it doesn't even work across models from the same manufacturer.

I've tried it out a few times and it worked fine. I could setup a WDS link between my WDR3600 and my Netgear 3500Lv1. But your mileage may very. The setting is under "wireless 2.4GHz" and "wireless 5GHz" on the WDR3600. Just check the box that says "enable WDS bridging".

 

[mynameisbryanok]

Correct. TP-Links firmware for the WDR3600 does not have wireless client mode, only WDS. Which may work, but WDS is less standard than most standards, so sometimes it does not work across different manufacturers of routers. Sometimes it doesn't even work across models from the same manufacturer.

I've tried it out a few times and it worked fine. I could setup a WDS link between my WDR3600 and my Netgear 3500Lv1. But your mileage may very. The setting is under "wireless 2.4GHz" and "wireless 5GHz" on the WDR3600. Just check the box that says "enable WDS bridging".

Okay I'll keep you posted If I run into any issues. The router should be here tomorrow afternoon.

 

[mynameisbryanok]

Correct. TP-Links firmware for the WDR3600 does not have wireless client mode, only WDS. Which may work, but WDS is less standard than most standards, so sometimes it does not work across different manufacturers of routers. Sometimes it doesn't even work across models from the same manufacturer.

I've tried it out a few times and it worked fine. I could setup a WDS link between my WDR3600 and my Netgear 3500Lv1. But your mileage may very. The setting is under "wireless 2.4GHz" and "wireless 5GHz" on the WDR3600. Just check the box that says "enable WDS bridging".

Everything is set up working for most of the devices, having the 5GHz is nice for the devices that are able to take advantage of it. So my laptop(pc) and my girlfriends laptop(mac) are both working off of the bridged router as well as my phone(android). The only issue I'm currently having is my ipad and my girlfriends iPhone don't seem to want to connect to the 5GHz or the 2.4GHz. Any idea why this might be an issue?

 

[azazel1024]

Not entirely sure on that. Try wiping the networking settings on the phone and iPad. Just go under the network and click forget on it. See if that will work.

 

[htismaqe]

If the network is not available (e.g. the SSID name has changed or it is not in range) it won't show up under Wifi settings so you won't be able to forget it.

I would recommend going into General settings and then to "Reset". You should see a "Reset Network Settings" option about halfway down. Be aware this will remove ALL network settings, so you'll have to reattach to any networks you want to use. And it will change the name of your device (under General | About) back to the defaults.