GT-AC5300 QoS and Tempsense

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C.O.P.S

Occasional Visitor
I just bought and deployed the GT-AC5300 a few days ago. I'm coming from an AC88U. The GUI is somewhat different. Here's the thing, under QoS (adaptive) in the AC88u you could drag and drop color coded priority levels onto specific devices. In the GT-AC5300 on the QoS page there's no option to do this. Is my unit borked, does that ability not exist in this unit, or has it been moved to some other section? I look under "game boost" and it looks like that old priority system but is it? And if it is why move it and why call it "game boost"? Am I on the right track or is "game boost" some totally different monster? I notice if I enable QoS then enable "game boost", then disable just "game boost" it also disables QoS. What's the deal here? I don't want to "boost games", I've already placed gaming at the top of the list under custom in QoS. I want per device level hierachical QoS prioritization regardless of whether I happen to be "gaming" right now or not. Thanks for any insight.
 

L&LD

Part of the Furniture
Are the routers on the same codebase? Was the RT-AC88U on RMerlin firmware?

You're probably correct that they moved it and renamed it.

I have to ask, why did you buy the GT-AC5300 today? There are much better, newer, and cheaper routers out there right now (RT-AX88U/RT-AX86U).
 

C.O.P.S

Occasional Visitor
Are the routers on the same codebase? Was the RT-AC88U on RMerlin firmware?

You're probably correct that they moved it and renamed it.

I have to ask, why did you buy the GT-AC5300 today? There are much better, newer, and cheaper routers out there right now (RT-AX88U/RT-AX86U).
Howdy. The AC88u was usually on Merlin but not always (all the way up to and including 386 beta2).

I need LACP so my options were already trimmed down. You might recall I'm the one who's 5ghz radio died in an odd way (see able but not connectable), anyway the cpu on that ac88u was stuck at 92c. I noticed just simply removing the lid would drop temps 20+ degrees. So I didn't want to go with another ac88u nor an ax88u, I wanted the more open top style like the ax89x, ax11000, rt-ac5300 or gt-ac5300. The GT-AC5300 was priced less than an ax88u and only roughly $70 more than an ac88u. The ax89x and ax11000 are just too rich for my rural working class budget. Plus I have no need for wifi6.

I did labor over the decision between rt-ac5300 and gt-ac5300, the keys being Merlin or no Merlin, dualcore vs quadcore. In the end though since it was only a $50 dollar difference I decided on quadcore with my fingers tightly crossed that Merlins GT experiment goes well and he adds the gt-ac5300.

So far I am enjoying the gt-ac5300. No issues yet. Definitely liked the old GUI more, but the "fancy" GUI isn't bad exactly it's just different, maybe dare I say less intuitive. That could well be because I'm used to the "old" way.

Other than this mysterious QoS, and not being able to figure out how to check radio temps, all else has been great. I got the cpu temps (66c), but the old commands for radio temps don't work. If I get these two things sorted I'll be happy.
 

C.O.P.S

Occasional Visitor
Ok so at least the temperature thing is settled. Here's how I got it to work in case anyone else is interested.
For the cpu temps

Code:
cat /proc/dmu/temperature

does not work for me. So what I did was this. Login to the web GUI, "router.asus.com". After you've logged in the url will look like this "router.asus.com/GameDashboard.asp". Replace the "/GameDashboard.asp" part with "/ajax_coretmp.asp". Hit enter. If done right it'll switch to a blank page with simple text at the top telling you the temp of the cpu.

For the wifi radios I ssh'd in and used

Code:
nvram get wl0_ifname

repeat for wl1 and wl2.

This revealed: eth6, eth7, and eth8. Then use

Code:
wl -i eth6 phy_tempsense

repeat for eth7 and eth8.

If I understand correctly you need to divide the result by half then add 20?

So anyway on my GT-AC5300 I'm getting mid 60's cpu, low to mid 40's on all three radios. Hopefully this helps others. Now I'm off to solve the mystery of GT QoS.
 
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ForkWNY

Regular Contributor
@C.O.P.S - thanks for figuring the temperatures out and summarizing it in one thread. I wasn't sure how to get temps off of my GT-AC5300 as none of the shell commands I was finding online did the job. It would be nice if ASUS added temperature read-out in the tools menu, as the Merlin firmware does for supported routers.
 

C.O.P.S

Occasional Visitor
@C.O.P.S - thanks for figuring the temperatures out and summarizing it in one thread. I wasn't sure how to get temps off of my GT-AC5300 as none of the shell commands I was finding online did the job. It would be nice if ASUS added temperature read-out in the tools menu, as the Merlin firmware does for supported routers.
Hey no problem, and thank you.

I'm not a linux "nerd", I never even messed with ssh stuff until very recently when my ac88u gave up the 5g ghost. I found it nearly impossible to find simple answers to simple questions. After about two days of reading TONS of linuxy stuff. I finally hit upon the pieces of the puzzle, and not all in the same one spot either.

Yeah that's something that always bothered me, why hide the thermal info. There are some other things that bother me about stock firmware. No ability to disable automatic update, even before the hijack method was discovered I still didn't like auto-update. Also not being able to set log levels to block out the humdrum and only see critical entries of importance. And a few other things.

I really like Merlins approach but I don't like being limited in my purchasing decisions by whether or not Merlin supports it. Recently My wife and I were talking about it and I realized one day Merlin will die, or retire, or maybe even get abducted by networking inept aliens. What of us then? I decided then to just buy what I want and do what I need to do to make it do what I want it to do (if possible), Merlin or no Merlin.

Who knows though, he might have success in his GT experiment. But in either case it is probably wiser for us "laypeople" to start to learn at least some of this stuff and become more self reliant. And if we can lend each other a hand along the way we all win.

I edited the threat title so it might be easier for others to find this info. Also I still haven't had time to delve into the Mystery of the GT QoS, maybe this weekend when it won't interfere with work from home stuff going on here.
 

ForkWNY

Regular Contributor
@C.O.P.S - do any of the posts in the thread below help at all? I know the QoS tab is moved under Game Acceleration, but am not sure how it compares to QoS in other ASUS routers, or which firmware you're running on your GT-AC5300 (are you on the latest 386_41994 beta, or using an official?)


I haven't messed with QoS, I've always left it off. What would compel me to use it is if I had devices on the network that were struggling to perform up to par. I've just never personally had any use cases for it. For any WiFi devices that need priority, I would consider placing them on one of the two 5Ghz bands, and putting everything else I didn't care about on the other 5Ghz band. That way you have a more dedicated band for devices that require additional bandwidth (home cameras, media streaming devices, etc...put them on a dedicated 5Ghz band). That only applies to wireless clients, I know, but something to keep in mind when you have 3 bands available.

If I were to decide to use QoS, I'd probably flip the App Analysis option on to see where priority is needed and go from there.
 
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L&LD

Part of the Furniture
@C.O.P.S that is a fair assessment (post 6) of where things are today. But it has been like that since 2012 too. ;)

I've never felt limited by (strictly) sticking to only RMerlin supported routers. Nor do my customers think they are either. Most actually state the opposite. They appreciate the fact that there is not a lot of choices, depending on their network needs (or simply personal 'wants').

Nobody has any guarantee that they'll wake up tomorrow and be able to do what they were doing yesterday. I'm a prime example of that (@martinr may remember, and I continue to thank him for his support. My friend, I've missed you!) and there have been a few recent posts that state similar circumstances for those members too.

But that doesn't negate the benefits that RMerlin firmware offers. And I don't like betting 'against' people either, for reasons that apply to all of us (we're all human, I believe), I'd rather bet 'for' them and (possibly) be wrong, than otherwise.

I have a customer that I occasionally kept suggesting an Asus/RMerlin powered network for a few years, but for one reason or another (many times, one or more of the reasons you state above), they couldn't be 'convinced' to try it back then. Their ISP provided equipment (on healthy up/down (wired) speeds) finally proved inept at providing a safe, reliable, and consistent wireless networking environment for them and their WFH needs, and they asked me to show them what RMerlin can offer.

For the last 4 months, there has been nothing but praise for the network performance from them. They started out with 384.19_0 and are currently running 386.1_0, and it wasn't a smooth process from their perspective (even if it was for me). They are not only 'believers', but also question themselves why they took so long to do this too.

It took (slightly) relocating the RT-AX88U I set up for them vs. their previous router. New SSIDs (I told them they were on their own with all their devices, otherwise :) ). A few attempts at gaining the best control channels possible for both bands. And a couple of network resets on more than a handful of their client devices too (old customizations meant to fix even older issues, but causing problems with anything current, today). A couple of the family members even had to learn to use different browsers (and shocked how good MS Edge was when set up for them).

Are we guaranteed that we will have the benefits of RMerlin support, forever? No.

But we can use what is available today and support him to keep improving things as possible.

Even when/if RMerlin decides to stop this 'little side project' of his, we will still be benefiting from his work too if Asus keeps adding and borrowing features RMerlin introduced so long ago.

Of course, we are all free to proceed on whatever principles we believe in. But here, I choose to believe in the person first.

And the technology and hardware second. For which we will always be able to find a way to 'make it work' for us.

But I'm here (after a few years 'break') because of what RMerlin, among others, has so selflessly offered to all (I too want to give what I can).

I am but a small sliver of a mirror that Eric has shown himself to be to this networking community, that we've all built here (and beginning with @thiggins).

And I know these great works will continue.

@john9527, @GNUton, and many others already show this possibility. And I thank them all.
 

C.O.P.S

Occasional Visitor
@C.O.P.S - do any of the posts in the thread below help at all? I know the QoS tab is moved under Game Acceleration, but am not sure how it compares to QoS in other ASUS routers, or which firmware you're running on your GT-AC5300 (are you on the latest 386_41994 beta, or using an official?)


I haven't messed with QoS, I've always left it off. What would compel me to use it is if I had devices on the network that were struggling to perform up to par. I've just never personally had any use cases for it. For any WiFi devices that need priority, I would consider placing them on one of the two 5Ghz bands, and putting everything else I didn't care about on the other 5Ghz band. That way you have a more dedicated band for devices that require additional bandwidth (home cameras, media streaming devices, etc...put them on a dedicated 5Ghz band). That only applies to wireless clients, I know, but something to keep in mind when you have 3 bands available.

If I were to decide to use QoS, I'd probably flip the App Analysis option on to see where priority is needed and go from there.
I had read that thread before. It doesn't help. Something is different.


GTGUI.png


You can see on the left hand side, no QoS and no Game Boost. Instead they are bundled into "Game Acceleration". Notice Game Boost down below. If I click QoS tab there are no options to prioritize devices. If I click Gear Accelerator it gives the option to add gaming devices, no custom priority. If I turn Game Boost on and click go, I get a new window that sort of looks like it might be the per device prioritization.

But if it is.....why call it Game Boost? And why have a separate "Gear Accelerator". It's almost like they took QoS and ripped it into three parts.

Yeah if I had symmetrical ultra internet I wouldn't use QoS at all. But in either case I want to understand my machine. Thanks for the reply though.
 

C.O.P.S

Occasional Visitor
@C.O.P.S that is a fair assessment (post 6) of where things are today. But it has been like that since 2012 too. ;)

I've never felt limited by (strictly) sticking to only RMerlin supported routers. Nor do my customers think they are either. Most actually state the opposite. They appreciate the fact that there is not a lot of choices, depending on their network needs (or simply personal 'wants').

Nobody has any guarantee that they'll wake up tomorrow and be able to do what they were doing yesterday. I'm a prime example of that (@martinr may remember, and I continue to thank him for his support. My friend, I've missed you!) and there have been a few recent posts that state similar circumstances for those members too.

But that doesn't negate the benefits that RMerlin firmware offers. And I don't like betting 'against' people either, for reasons that apply to all of us (we're all human, I believe), I'd rather bet 'for' them and (possibly) be wrong, than otherwise.

I have a customer that I occasionally kept suggesting an Asus/RMerlin powered network for a few years, but for one reason or another (many times, one or more of the reasons you state above), they couldn't be 'convinced' to try it back then. Their ISP provided equipment (on healthy up/down (wired) speeds) finally proved inept at providing a safe, reliable, and consistent wireless networking environment for them and their WFH needs, and they asked me to show them what RMerlin can offer.

For the last 4 months, there has been nothing but praise for the network performance from them. They started out with 384.19_0 and are currently running 386.1_0, and it wasn't a smooth process from their perspective (even if it was for me). They are not only 'believers', but also question themselves why they took so long to do this too.

It took (slightly) relocating the RT-AX88U I set up for them vs. their previous router. New SSIDs (I told them they were on their own with all their devices, otherwise :) ). A few attempts at gaining the best control channels possible for both bands. And a couple of network resets on more than a handful of their client devices too (old customizations meant to fix even older issues, but causing problems with anything current, today). A couple of the family members even had to learn to use different browsers (and shocked how good MS Edge was when set up for them).

Are we guaranteed that we will have the benefits of RMerlin support, forever? No.

But we can use what is available today and support him to keep improving things as possible.

Even when/if RMerlin decides to stop this 'little side project' of his, we will still be benefiting from his work too if Asus keeps adding and borrowing features RMerlin introduced so long ago.

Of course, we are all free to proceed on whatever principles we believe in. But here, I choose to believe in the person first.

And the technology and hardware second. For which we will always be able to find a way to 'make it work' for us.

But I'm here (after a few years 'break') because of what RMerlin, among others, has so selflessly offered to all (I too want to give what I can).

I am but a small sliver of a mirror that Eric has shown himself to be to this networking community, that we've all built here (and beginning with @thiggins).

And I know these great works will continue.

@john9527, @GNUton, and many others already show this possibility. And I thank them all.
I know! Like I said, my fingers are tightly crossed on his GT experiment. I respect his ability, and prefer his work over stock. But even he wouldn't be, and wouldn't be doing what he does if not for the spirit of what I expressed (or tried to) earlier.

Taking it upon ones self to learn, to venture forth, and to share with others our discoveries and the fruits of our labors. He can correct me if I'm wrong, but it is this very spirit that makes "Merlin" what it is, yes? He doesn't do it for money. He seems to do it for firstly a labor of love, and secondly to share with others.

Like you implied, the persons before the technology. I want to help too. I want to venture forth, discover, and share. I want to help others who like me might be struggling with some aspect. And as I see it GT users are in a, if you will, frontier of their own.

I don't want to feel or think like I'm totally reliant upon Merlin for everything. I have read some threads here where people talk smack and act like Merlin owes them something, like it's Merlins responsibility to give them this or that or figure this or that out for them. I find it rather distasteful. The guy takes time out of his private life, and provides free of charge, something that most of those people can't even begin to comprehend. He doesn't "owe" anyone anything. As I see it, it's the other way around. The people who have benefitted by his labor......owe him, something.

Hopefully I've made my position a little clearer. Now I'm off to experiment with GT QoS. Have a lovely day.
 

C.O.P.S

Occasional Visitor
I believe I have solved, to an extent, the Mystery of the GT QoS. It is broken apart into multiple sections.

First on the left hand column click "Game Acceleration". Next click the QoS tab. Enable QoS. Choose categorical priority preference: Gaming, Surfing, Streaming, Custom et cetera. Nothing else can be done on that page. I'll come back to and cover "Game Boost" and "Gear Acceleration" later.

This is the thing I was looking for originally, which I thought should've been on the QoS tab but isn't. If all you want is simple general per device prioritization, left hand column click "Traffic Analyzer". Next click the "Bandwidth Monitor" tab. Here is where you find the drag-n-drop per device basic/general priority level. Drag-n-drop the priority level you want onto each device (notice the thin border around the device icon changes color), hit apply. "App Analysis" is optional, on if you want a more granular view, off if not.

Note devices must be currently on for them to appear for priority selection.

BasicDevicePriority.jpg


Ok back to the "Game Acceleration", "Game Boost", and "Gear Acceleration".

Warning: I have discovered that if you turn QoS on it does NOT automatically turn "Game Boost" on. However if you have both on and you turn "Game Boost" off it will also turn QoS off. If you do this you can simply turn QoS back on and "Game Boost" will remain off.

On the "Game Boost" page is yet another device level priority list.
On the "Gear Acceleration" tab, you can just add devices.

GameAccelerationSection.jpg


This I think is how it all works. It's a four tier/way prioritization system.

Lowest most basic level, QoS, categorical: Gaming, Streaming, Surfing, Custom et cetera. For many users this level will be good enough. For everyone else, read on.

The next level up is the basic/general drag-n-drop per device prioritization, found in "Traffic Analyzer">"Bandwidth Monitor". More control over who specifically gets how much of the pie.

The next level up, "Game Boost" acts as an override giving gaming packets (specifically) priority to and from a specified device, regardless of that devices priority level as set in "Bandwidth Monitor" and regardless of the categorical preferences set in "QoS".

The highest level up, "Gear Accelerator" acts as an override above the others. Devices activated here will get the absolute highest QoS priority no matter what. Or perhaps it's a QoS bypass?

My thoughts, and a few use case scenarios.

Under QoS you already set categorical priority when you chose the categorical importance: Gaming, Work From Home, Web Surfing, et cetera. If you put Gaming at the top.....gaming packets already get highest priority. In this scenario you don't need "Game Boost" or "Gear Acceleration". However if your household has multiple gamers, you can place the most important users device in "Game Boost", then that persons gaming packets take priority.

Example: QoS, "Gaming". "Bandwidth" Pa's xbox and Jr's ps4 both have highest priority. Pa's xbox is added to "Game Boost". When Pa and Jr are playing at the same time, Pa's xbox packets will get priority over Jr's ps4 packets.

Another idea, say you have "Streaming" (or anything other than Gaming) as the highest categorical priority. You find you have a few minutes to play "that one game". In this scenario if your device is in the "Game Boost" section, "that one game" will temporarily override everyone's "Streaming" priority.

One last scenario. Let's say you have a house full of gamers. Ma and Pa put their devices in "Game Boost", they get gaming packet priority over the kids. One level further....let's say Pa (or Ma) pays the internet bill. That person wants the absolute highest priority no matter what. Their device goes into "Gear Acceleration". I guess.

It's like a QoS mini game of one upping each other in priority.

I read before Merlin explained why (I think it was) fq_codel was removed from adaptive to traditional, was because he could no longer intercept QoS, or something like that? Trendmicro changed the code or something, I can't remember the particulars. Either way the Adaptive QoS is completely closed source. So how in fact, if in fact, all of this actually works, or doesn't.....is a guessing game. Only Trendmicro, and likely to a lesser extent Asus can know, I guess.

Exhale. Now I'm going to shut my brain off, enjoy my new router, and go play "that one game" for a bit.
 

ForkWNY

Regular Contributor
It is mind boggling how QoS/GameBoost/Gear Acceleration all tie together in the GT's firmware...the various layers are confusing to say the least. I think that's mostly due to how ASUS has slapped "ROG" terminology over everything. The documentation isn't exactly clear either. Excellent analysis and investigative work though...some of the features that hadn't made much sense to me in the past make more sense after reading your post!
 

C.O.P.S

Occasional Visitor
It is mind boggling how QoS/GameBoost/Gear Acceleration all tie together in the GT's firmware...the various layers are confusing to say the least. I think that's mostly due to how ASUS has slapped "ROG" terminology over everything. The documentation isn't exactly clear either. Excellent analysis and investigative work though...some of the features that hadn't made much sense to me in the past make more sense after reading your post!
Thanks. Yeah I noticed that Asus guides show non-ROG GUI, and aren't always clear anyway. I just found a video for the GT-AC2900. Funny stuff, hip music, black and red everywhere, and the guy says all you do is click enable and you are good to go. Haha....me thinks there's a bit more to it than that. I found something interesting too. If I use:

Code:
nvram get qos_rulelist

What I expected to see was what you'd see if looking at the QoS tab in the GUI. "Gaming, Surfing, Streaming, Work from Home, Custom".....and so on. With some sort of a priority indicator. Personally I use Custom.

But what I found was: Web Surf, HTTPS, File Transfer, and File Transfer.

The per device priority levels (Traffic Analyzer>Bandwidth Monitor) are numerically backwards. I don't have anything set below "Default" but it seems to go like this: 0=Highest, 1=High, 2=Medium, 3=Default, 4=Lowest. Even the Web Surf, HTTPS, File Transfer, and File Transfer have priority indicators, of a different sort. The priority indicators attached to "Web Surf, HTTPS, File Transfer, and File Transfer" are influenced by the categorical choice you made in the QoS tab.

So in other words, it seems, there isn't a category called specifically "gaming" or "work from home", but rather those choices influence the priority bias between "Web Surf, HTTPS, File Transfer, and File Transfer". How Game Boost and Gear Acceleration fit in I'm not sure yet.

It's like a murder mystery. We have a corpse, a culprit, a witness.....but little to no clue how it was done or why.

I'll keep at it and post my findings.
 

C.O.P.S

Occasional Visitor
I've had some more time to throw at this. It turns out I misunderstood something regarding "Game Boost". When clicking "go" it pops up a new tab with a qos/hardware monitor like page. I misunderstood this. I thought it was in fact a secondary or hidden place to add devices.

It is NOT.

Here's what it really is. Enabling "Game Boost" simply changes your QoS categorical choice from whatever you had it set to (in my case "Custom") to "Gaming". And that is all that it does. It is no different than simply going to the QoS tab and choosing "Gaming". They are one in the same.

So either it's just "fluff" or it was decided that clicking on "Game Acceleration" then "QoS" then "Gaming" then "Apply" takes too long.

Pardon my earlier mistakes. Game Boost will not give gaming devices priority over non-gaming devices. Device priority must be selected in "Traffic Analyzer" "Bandwidth Monitor". There is no need to enable game boost at all. As all it does, I repeat, is change your QoS category selection to "Gaming". If you enable game boost then go to QoS you will see it changed to gaming. If you choose a different category in QoS the router automatically disables game boost.

Mystery solved as far as I'm concerned.

"Gear Acceleration" on the other hand I'm not yet sure. Will post if and when I figure it out.
 

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