How good are the new Asus AX routers with old N devices?

[BobP]

My current router is an Asus TM-1900 (a T-Mobile branded Asus AC68u that is stuck on firmware 376) which has been an extremely good, stable, and reliable trooper for years. Most of my devices are also older: three T410 Thinkpad laptops with built in N adapters, and 3 Tivo DVRs ( one AC, one N, and the third I have not been able to determine, either N or AC.). I also have a desktop computer but it is ethernet wired on the LAN.

I am concerned about the security of my TM-1900 with the old firmware although to my knowledge I have never been hacked or attacked and Gibson's Shields Up site says I am secure. For this reason I am considering getting an AC86 or AX86 that I can put the latest firmware on. I don't need AX capability at the moment but am only considering it for future capabilities and better current performance if it has it for my old devices.

I have been scouring this site and others for information on using the new routers with older N and G devices but have not been able to find that much but I have learned enough to be dangerous now. Which brings me to the main question of my post: Would an AX86 router have better, equal, or worse WIFI throughput performance with these old devices at medium to long ranges than an AC68u? My biggest concern is that the latest and greatest routers are designed for the latest devices and might not perform as well with the old devices as my current router.

The biggest loads on my WIFI system are just watching shows on my various Tivo's that are recorded on a Tivo in a different room. So the first priority for me is increased WIFI signal and throughput at range. My current router will just provide enough WIFI performance to reach my basement so I am hoping an upgrade would improve on that but not expecting it from what I have read. My comcast internet connection is only 100 mbps so blazing WIFI capacity is not a priority.

The other question is weather an AX86 at an additional $100 over the AC86 would provide any additional performance in my use.

It would be much appreciated if someone who has already made an upgrade from an AC68 to an AC86 or AX86 could provide some feedback on this.

 

[bbunge]

My current router is an Asus TM-1900 (a T-Mobile branded Asus AC68u that is stuck on firmware 376) which has been an extremely good, stable, and reliable trooper for years. Most of my devices are also older: three T410 Thinkpad laptops with built in N adapters, and 3 Tivo DVRs ( one AC, one N, and the third I have not been able to determine, either N or AC.). I also have a desktop computer but it is ethernet wired on the LAN.

I am concerned about the security of my TM-1900 with the old firmware although to my knowledge I have never been hacked or attacked and Gibson's Shields Up site says I am secure. For this reason I am considering getting an AC86 or AX86 that I can put the latest firmware on. I don't need AX capability at the moment but am only considering it for future capabilities and better current performance if it has it for my old devices.

I have been scouring this site and others for information on using the new routers with older N and G devices but have not been able to find that much but I have learned enough to be dangerous now. Which brings me to the main question of my post: Would an AX86 router have better, equal, or worse WIFI throughput performance with these old devices at medium to long ranges than an AC68u? My biggest concern is that the latest and greatest routers are designed for the latest devices and might not perform as well with the old devices as my current router.

The biggest loads on my WIFI system are just watching shows on my various Tivo's that are recorded on a Tivo in a different room. So the first priority for me is increased WIFI signal and throughput at range. My current router will just provide enough WIFI performance to reach my basement so I am hoping an upgrade would improve on that but not expecting it from what I have read. My comcast internet connection is only 100 mbps so blazing WIFI capacity is not a priority.

The other question is weather an AX86 at an additional $100 over the AC86 would provide any additional performance in my use.

It would be much appreciated if someone who has already made an upgrade from an AC68 to an AC86 or AX86 could provide some feedback on this.

Either the AC86U or AX86U would be a good choice. An AX68U is also something to consider if you want to save a few bucks. The advantage of the AX is a bit more future proofing. The AX has WPA3 which you will use in time. And you may be surprised that with driver updates some of your clients may actually be able to use WPA3!
The problem you may have is finding an Asus AX router. Seems like they come into stock and are sold out quickly. That speaks volumes for their popularity.

 

[thiggins]

11ax adds features, OFDMA in particular, and new bit fields to wireless packets. Some devices handle unknown fields badly and may not be able to connect or drop connection frequently.

Fortunately, most AX routers allow you to disable AX features and limit operation to N, if you wish. (Actually, 802.11ac is 5 GHz only. An AC or Wi-Fi 5 router actually operates in 11n on 2.4 GHz.)

I see no reason to spend the extra money, especially $100, for an AX router. WPA3 upgrades for your existing devices are unlikely.

An AC router would be a more cost-effective choice.

 

[BreakingDad]

Get the AX86U, the mere mention of that name gets the girls going. Trust me ;P

 

[RMerlin]

The most common causes of compatibility issues I have seen these past few years are the addition of support for Airtime Fairness and Universal Beamforming in recent models. Disabling these two features (especially on the 2.4 GHz band where most cheap IoT clients would connect) will greatly help. Quite a few inexpensive wireless printers for instance had trouble with Airtime Fairness being enabled.

 

[BobP]

Thanks for all the replies guys. I didn't see anyone mention a decrease in performance with the AX routers on old devices. My local Microcenter has both the AX86u and the AC86u in stock so I am going to pick up an AX today. I will test and compare the performance of it with my current router and report back here. My current TM-AC1900 had a noticeable improvement in throughput at range compared to my previous Asus N66 with my current devices so I am hoping I will get a little improvement with the AX86u. Fingers Crossed.

 

[BobP]

After a day of testing and a few days of use, the short and quick answer is yes, an AX86u router will perform better than a TM-AC1900 (T-Mobile branded Asus AC68u) stuck on firmware 376.xxxx even if you are only using G, N, and AC devices. "Better" meaning higher throughput, better stability, better responsiveness at all ranges but most importantly at the limits of the TM-AC1900's range. For details on my testing keep reading.

First of all the disclaimer. This is my first thread here and I am a novice when it comes to routers. I don't know what most of the settings in these routers even do. The tools I had at my disposal were an old version 3 InSSIDer Home network analyzer software tool, the built in Lenovo wireless signal gauge, the online Xfinity speedtest, and the WIFI signal strength gauges in my Tivo DVRs.

My router is located in my 2nd floor office. I did not test there because when I am in the office I use the LAN. The bedroom Tivo is also on the 2nd floor at the opposite side of the house. On the 1st floor is the living room Tivo, and in the basement is the 3rd Tivo. I first checked the WIFI strength with the TM-AC1900 on all of the Tivos. I then carried my Windows 7 laptop with the InSSIDer software on it to each Tivo location and checked the signal strength, and the download speeds with the Xfinity web speedtest app. I have another identical laptop that I have installed Windows 10 on so for grins I tested with that also. There was no significant difference in readings between the operating systems so I did not due any further testing with the Windows 10 laptop. I recorded all of the readings in a spreadsheet.

I just wanted to do a quick and dirty comparison first so I powered down my AC1900, unplugged it from the modem, power cycled the modem, connected my new AX86u, powered it up, and entered the exact same SSIDs and passwords. I did not update the firmware but I did turn off the AX network as I do not have any AX devices. I then repeated the same tests on the AX86u that I performed on the AC1900.

Results:
Bedroom Tivo Location: Tivo Reception Signal, 50% ->65% = +30%, T410 Download 5G Throughput, 92->110 = +20%
Living Room Tivo Location: Tivo Reception Signal, 35%->45% = +29%, T410 Download 5G Throughput, 40->78 = +95%
Basement Tivo Location: Tivo Reception Signal, 30%->47% = +57%, T410 Download 5G Throughput, 15->36 = +140%

As you can see, theoretically, I got a significant improvement where I needed it most, in the basement. But in real use, am I going to notice any difference? I spent a day doing the testing and the next three days using my Tivos and laptops in various locations. There was noticable improvement with all of them.

With the laptops I got increased responsiveness. With networked Tivos you can watch a recorded show on any other Tivo if you have a strong enough network. If not, you will get buffering and/or lost connections and then you need to transfer the show from one Tivo to the one that you want to watch it on. Transferring takes awhile. With the AX86u I was able to watch any show on any Tivo from any Tivo without any problems. Also my Ipad (an AC device) did not lose WIFI signal on my deck as it usually did with the AC1900. With the AC1900 I usually had to use cellular service with it on the deck. It worked fine on the deck on WIFI this past weekend with the AX86u.

My throughput numbers are not as high as usually discussed on these forums but that is because I only need and have a 100 Mbps internet connection. However for my system the bottom line is that the AX86u provided just the extra capacity at range to eliminate the need for a second AP or Mesh network vs. the TM-AC1900.

I am not knocking the TM-AC1900. T-Mobile loaned it to me free of charge years ago because I had a weak cell signal at my house. It was a big improvement over my previous N66u. I performed the original set up and it has been rock solid ever since. The firmware updated once when I first set it up but has said I have the latest firmware every time I've checked since then. I was getting a little nervous about the security so I started looking around for a new router. Looks like with the AX86u I will be getting increased security and performance.

 

[L&LD]

@BobP that is my experience also. Any customer that had the budget to upgrade to an RT-AX86U (no matter what their previous router, client devices, or ISP service level was), was not keen on saving the few dollars to drop to any lessor model. Network performance is not just raw 'peak' throughput. It is also how effortless the things we do with it, happen.

 

[thiggins]

@BobP Thanks for taking the time to report your findings. You did a fine job in your experimentation.

 

[BobP]

@BobP that is my experience also. Any customer that had the budget to upgrade to an RT-AX86U (no matter what their previous router, client devices, or ISP service level was), was not keen on saving the few dollars to drop to any lessor model. Network performance is not just raw 'peak' throughput. It is also how effortless the things we do with it, happen.

In my case it was not so much just saving a few dollars as not wanting to pay the extra $100 over the AC86u if I did not get any performance benefit with my old devices, especially with 6e routers on the horizon. I was prepared to take the AX86u back and get an AC86u if my tests did not show any performance increase. But since I did see a marked benefit, I'll be keeping the AX86u.

 

[BobP]

@BobP Thanks for taking the time to report your findings. You did a fine job in your experimentation.

Thanks Tim. You are most welcome. I hope someone else in my position can benefit from my tests. I almost must say that I have an increased appreciation for all the testing and articles you have provided. That is a lot of work.

One other thing I'd like to add for the other fellow novices on the forums. The InSSIDer software I used is good for determining how crowded your channels are, but it was not very useful for determining signal strength levels. It fluctuated greatly but also showed the same average -50 db attenuation at all of my test locations. I was using an older version 3 of the software so perhaps the newer versions are better. Similarly for my Lenovo Wifi strength gauge. It was too erratic and inconsistent to be of much use.

The wifi strength gauge in the Tivos and the Xfinity Internet web wifi speedtest were much more stable and consistent when testing the various locations and router setups. The only reason I used the Xfinity test over others is because I get my internet service from Xfinity. My concern with using the internet speed tests is that the varying loads on my local internet at different times of the day might skew the results but I did not notice this. There may have been a noticeable effect if I was testing with higher download speeds though.

Now I just have to learn how to set up this AX86u properly. Fortunately for me, someone else asked a question about this recently on the Asus AX forums and there a number of replies and suggestions there.

This website has been very helpful and I am glad that I found it.