New to NAS - Semi Power User

[cg5000]

Hi everybody,

First, thanks for taking the time to read this and post your comments. I'm new to NAS, but pretty savvy with computers. I like to build PC's, but have no experience with RAID either. So that you know too, I am new to databases and installing them (mentioning this cause I know some of these NAS devices require an SQL install?)

About my use of my machine - (So that I can get the best feedback, I think its important for me to acclimate you with my use of the computers I have here.)

I built my machine here (Intel Core i7, Windows 7, 12GB Ram, 10K RPM C Drive, secondary drive just for files called the "D" drive., etc.) I have a "20MB" cable connection via COMCAST for internet. It's A nice machine (yes, I have a loving relationship with it lol) designed really as a workstation and gaming machine. I do mostly multimedia stuff on this machine.

I handle I.T. and web related projects for several non-techy clients, backup my DVDs to a hard drive (My D Drive), store audio there (and other files) do some light video editing (on files stored on this drive, etc.) My C drive is just for programs and OS.

In the past, Ive used a "D" drive to store all this multimedia/files I've collected, then manually backed it up using Acronis to an external 500GB USB 2.0 HD. (slow) I do a backup once a month, then take it offsite to a safe deposit box. I do this in case something happens to my home (heaven forbid like a fire). Ive got baby pics/vids and stuff on here I simply cannot afford to loose. (you guys all know the drill) I've got another of the same drive, that I keep here in my home office. So about once a month, I just take the drive at the safe deposit box, bring it here, backup, and then take the new, updated drive back to the bank. So - one here, one at the bank. Cant go wrong right? (Your probably laughing at me by now)

As you may have expected - I've now run into a storage conundrum

My external hard drives are full, and my "D" is full too (oh its a 1TB drive) and I think I've decided I want to get a NAS.

I THINK I need a NAS because:

• I want redundancy (RAID mirroring?) on any drive that I store this multimedia on.
• I want web accessibility from all my devices such as my Droid X Andorid Phone, and my laptop.
• I want my clients to have limited permission to their files through this NAS
• I DON'T want my computer to have to be on in order for me to access my files
• I want to provide them with an FTP type client to easily send me large files to a kind of "drop box"
• I think I need really fast connectivity because I do large file transfers ofter, and also video editing
• So, I think what I want to do is build a type of "cloud" solution for me and my clients right?

My questions are as follows:

1.) Should I do away with the "D" drive, and these external drives, and just start using a NAS via the gigabit LAN? (I guess routing everything through my Trendnet TEW-639GR WIFI router? Was thinking that because of the occasional video editing, this might be a problem, accessing the files via LAN as opposed to the "D" drive, which is SATA2 I believe.

2.) What model do you guys recommend? I am thinking I need a 2 bay (2x2TB) - -that should be sufficient. My understanding is that if its in RAID O? I will really only have 2TB to use, and 2TB will be a replica of the other.
FYI I was looking at this one - BUFFALO LS-WV4.0TL/R1 4TB (2x2TB) LinkStation Pro Duo RAID 0/1 Network Storage Small Cloud Builder review stated this device was slower than a snail... Also, I think I want one with its own dedicated Intel Atom processor right? To help really make it crush data transfers?

3.) Do I need an offsite backup? I tried Mozy, Carbonite, etc. ...but of course found that those are painfully slow. I think both services noted it would take like 35 days to upload all my stuff! lol Any recommendations ? Do I need two NAS's?

4.) Am I going to be able to do this config? I'm not really even sure how to assign a static IP - though I'm sure a quick Google search can turn me onto a resource that would make it a snap.

5.) Any other questions I should ask that Im not, or things I need to consider based on what you now know about me before making this expensive purchase?

Any other thoughts or comments you guys have, advice and stuff...much appreciated! I REALLY appreciate you guys helping me navigate through this decision and I'm so glad this website is here! Killer resource!

 

[stevech]

Another perspective re your ponderings:

I use Acronis to clone drives (cloned drive is bootable), drive-image, and do real-time constant backup of critical folders. Also use SecondCopy for critical folders.

Instead of slow USB, I have a large drive in an external enclosure that supports eSATA.

I also use RAID1 for drive failure protection - but that is NOT backup. A NAS itself has to be backed up- in case of file system corruption or NAS controller failure, or theft.

By automating backups to two drives here, one on another computer, and really critical folders also to a thumb drive I keep off-site, I've decided to not use cloud backup. I tried most of them. My financial data would never go there- they can decrypt (court order or fraud by employee), though it's not admitted. So I use SafeHouse to keep my own encrypted mountable "file-as-drive" that's wholly encrypted. That file of files can't be compromised.

So I view a home NAS' purpose as mostly multimedia serving on the home LAN, if you don't have an always-on windows PC with folder shares.

Photo sharing with distant family, IMO, is best done by passworded Picasa or Flickr or some such, as the upstream speed from residential internet is normally rather slow.

As to NAS: I don't have one, but lots of study has me eyeing most the Synology DS211J.

 

[teknojnky]

• I want redundancy (RAID mirroring?) on any drive that I store this multimedia on.
• I want web accessibility from all my devices such as my Droid X Andorid Phone, and my laptop.
• I want my clients to have limited permission to their files through this NAS
• I DON'T want my computer to have to be on in order for me to access my files
• I want to provide them with an FTP type client to easily send me large files to a kind of "drop box"
• I think I need really fast connectivity because I do large file transfers ofter, and also video editing
• So, I think what I want to do is build a type of "cloud" solution for me and my clients right?

My questions are as follows:

1.) Should I do away with the "D" drive, and these external drives, and just start using a NAS via the gigabit LAN? (I guess routing everything through my Trendnet TEW-639GR WIFI router? Was thinking that because of the occasional video editing, this might be a problem, accessing the files via LAN as opposed to the "D" drive, which is SATA2 I believe.

I would suggest you continue to use to use your local D drive for editing/manipulation, however once you have finalized your files you should store them on a nas. The reason is nas will never be as fast a locally attached sata drive, not necessarily because of bandwidth, but more for latency (the time it takes to react to read/write requests).

You can use your wifi router or a dedicated gigabit switch that connects to the router if you have one.

2.) What model do you guys recommend? I am thinking I need a 2 bay (2x2TB) - -that should be sufficient. My understanding is that if its in RAID O? I will really only have 2TB to use, and 2TB will be a replica of the other.
FYI I was looking at this one - BUFFALO LS-WV4.0TL/R1 4TB (2x2TB) LinkStation Pro Duo RAID 0/1 Network Storage Small Cloud Builder review stated this device was slower than a snail... Also, I think I want one with its own dedicated Intel Atom processor right? To help really make it crush data transfers?

your a little confused, raid 0 = no redundancy, the drives will add their space together. Raid 1 = redundancy = mirrored = no size increase.

keep in mind that raid is not a subsitute for backups, raid protects against a single disk failure, it does not protect against user error (deletes etc), fire/flood/theft).

3.) Do I need an offsite backup? I tried Mozy, Carbonite, etc. ...but of course found that those are painfully slow. I think both services noted it would take like 35 days to upload all my stuff! lol Any recommendations ? Do I need two NAS's?

whether you need offsite comes down to how much you value your data. as you have mentioned internet backup is limited to however fast your internet connection is, and often come with additional costs once you go over the various limits.

using 2 nas's is a good idea, ideally you would want to keep them in physically different locations (but then again the internet connection becomes a limitation), but even within the same location, 2 nas's are an effective way to protect your data.

4.) Am I going to be able to do this config? I'm not really even sure how to assign a static IP - though I'm sure a quick Google search can turn me onto a resource that would make it a snap.

yes, google is your best bet there, assigning static ips are really quite simple, its when you have to manage many different ips for dozens/hundreds of devices that it can quickly become overwhelming.

5.) Any other questions I should ask that Im not, or things I need to consider based on what you now know about me before making this expensive purchase?

Any other thoughts or comments you guys have, advice and stuff...much appreciated! I REALLY appreciate you guys helping me navigate through this decision and I'm so glad this website is here! Killer resource!

I would definately recommend an x86/atom based nas, these will cost more than some of the older models with sparc or other types of custom cpu, but it will be worth it due to almost all nas are based upon some flavor of customized linux OS and older non-x86 architectures are quickly running out of support.

If you go the 2 nas route, I would suggest you buy 1 nas first, get used to it and decide whether it meets your needs and performance expectations. If so then getting a 2nd one just like it makes it pretty simple, otherwise you might start looking at other similar brands/models.

It is normally fairly simple to have either nas backup to another regardless of brand/model using RSYNC or other methods.

 

[ntm1275]

Sorry if this reply is a bit long, but I was trying to cover all the points that you have asked

1.) Should I do away with the "D" drive, and these external drives, and just start using a NAS via the gigabit LAN? (I guess routing everything through my Trendnet TEW-639GR WIFI router? Was thinking that because of the occasional video editing, this might be a problem, accessing the files via LAN as opposed to the "D" drive, which is SATA2 I believe.

Accessing a high end NAS though the LAN would be your best option via a Gigabit connection
High end Atom or better NAS's can virtually max out a Gigabit connection (125MB's)

2.) What model do you guys recommend? I am thinking I need a 2 bay (2x2TB) - -that should be sufficient. My understanding is that if its in RAID O? I will really only have 2TB to use, and 2TB will be a replica of the other.
FYI I was looking at this one - BUFFALO LS-WV4.0TL/R1 4TB (2x2TB) LinkStation Pro Duo RAID 0/1 Network Storage Small Cloud Builder review stated this device was slower than a snail... Also, I think I want one with its own dedicated Intel Atom processor right? To help really make it crush data transfers?

Raid 0 will give you no redundancy if any of the disks fail - you will probably lose all your data, but Raid 0 tends to be the fastest for file transfers
If using 2x2TB, you will be able to use all the disk space minus whatever is used up during the formatting process
If using a 2 bay NAS, then Raid 1 (mirroring), would give you the redundancy of 1 disk failure, but you would loose half of you total disk space
As mentioned in point 1, Atom or above CPU's are the best to use if file transfer speeds are a priority, along with fast hard drives

3.) Do I need an offsite backup? I tried Mozy, Carbonite, etc. ...but of course found that those are painfully slow. I think both services noted it would take like 35 days to upload all my stuff! lol Any recommendations ? Do I need two NAS's?

Offsite backups cover the possibility theft, fire, water damage etc to the NAS if anything did happen
There are a few possibilities for off site backups
1. External USB drives, which can be stored off site
2. External eSATA drives that can be stored off site
3. Cloud storage - but can be pitifully slow, and may have a limit on the total storage that can be used
4. Second NAS located off site - to get this to work without the first backup taking forever over the internet, you can do the first backup locally, and then set it to do incremental backups (only file changes) when it is moved off site
I know Synology now offer the ability to sync (mirror) two NAS's, and this can be set to automatically 'mirror' any changes as soon as anything on the main NAS is changed - it can also encrypt and compress the transfer

4.) Am I going to be able to do this config? I'm not really even sure how to assign a static IP - though I'm sure a quick Google search can turn me onto a resource that would make it a snap.

Most NAS's come with detailed instruction on how to set them up, and they may also have User Forums and Wiki pages to help
Setting Static IP's isn't a difficult job, as you will find out if you Google it

5.) Any other questions I should ask that Im not, or things I need to consider based on what you now know about me before making this expensive purchase?

Yes a NAS can be an expensive purchase, but a generalisation would be that the faster you want it to be, the more you have to pay, as the hardware is of a higher spec


Moving on to what you want from your NAS:-

I want redundancy (RAID mirroring?) on any drive that I store this multimedia on.

That would be Raid 1 if choosing a 2 bay NAS

I want web accessibility from all my devices such as my Droid X Andorid Phone, and my laptop.

Most NAS manufacturers now have the features for iPhone, Android etc access

I want my clients to have limited permission to their files through this NAS

When setting up the NAS, you will be able to set up shared folders which you can specify what permissions are allowed - each folder can have different permissions for each user

I DON'T want my computer to have to be on in order for me to access my files

Most NAS's have 'remote' access capability

I want to provide them with an FTP type client to easily send me large files to a kind of "drop box"

Most NAS's have a built in Web 'file manager', which can be set to the same permissions as the shared folders mentioned a couple of points back
These 'file managers' can look and feel like Windows Explorer, it just needs the client to have a username and password to upload and download files, if that is what you have permitted them to do
They can also be used over a https connection to encrypt data if it is confidential or sensitive
Also, most do support FTP transfers as well

I think I need really fast connectivity because I do large file transfers ofter, and also video editing

This would mean a higher end NAS with at least an Atom CPU

So, I think what I want to do is build a type of "cloud" solution for me and my clients right?

A NAS has the capability to provide a cloud solution for your clients and yourself when you are away from your base, along with normal LAN connectivity when at the home base

Speaking from experience of using several Synology consumer NAS's over the last few years (DS106e, DS207+, DS209+II, DS1010+), I can confirm that Synology have the features to cover everything that you want in a NAS, and their current high end 2 bay unit (DS710+) is more than capable of delivering the speed that you need for file transfers (see the smallnetbuilder NAS charts)
But there are plenty of other manufacturers NAS's that can also do what you want

One last note if you go for the option of a second NAS for off site backups, the NAS used for the off site backup does not need to be as high spec as the main NAS as it's only being used for backups
So if you were considering the DS710+, then the second NAS could be their much cheaper DS211j
Personally if this option is considered, I would use two NAS's from the same manufacturer

 

[cg5000]

Great - thsanks for the replies guys! This helps a lot.

1.) Now...I think its down to two products:

Buffalo - TeraStation Pro™ Duo TS-WVH4.0TL/R1 2x2TB (4TB)
NetGear ReadyNas RNDU2220-100NAS 2x2TB (4TB)

Another question....


2.) How can I make it so if I access a file, download it, modify it, re-upload it....it sync automatically to my "D" drive (see my prior post for explanation as to what the "D" drive is for. Basically, I want to have an exactly clone of my "D" drive at any given time to my NAS and visa versa.

3.) Also, Ive purchased an external USB 3.0 hard drive to make a true backup of the NAS.

I should be all set??

 

[teknojnky]

1) I have 3 readynas and all have served me well. I can't speak for any other brands, but the readynas forums are open and typically very helpful.

2) you speak of the holy grail which unfortunately is not quite as simple as it seems. In other words, do not hold your breath. It is possible for most nas to have backup jobs to pull data from any other device/computer/d-drive, however these of course are not real-time, nor are they 2-way sync.

3) a wise choice