New to networking - does my router support CAKE?

360NoScoper

Regular Contributor
Hi, I'm new to this website.

Basically about 18 months ago I bought an ASUS RT-AC66U B1. I did some basic research about Bufferbloat and latency, found this forum and decided to buy that as it was a budget router that with Merlin installed would have access to FQ_Codel.

I thought this would solve my issues but it only subjectively only helped things slightly, also Merlin since then has no FQ_Codel option which is weird. I currently use the bandwidth limiter, which subjectively for gaming seems to have a positive effect especially when family are watching Netflix and gaming themselves. But it only feels slightly better, I still get BS like being shot around corners in CoD and my average Bufferbloat score is B.

I know ISP has an effect on this. Currently I'm with VM and a lot of people report Bufferbloat/latency issues with them. I still do notice a worse online gaming experience when multiple family members are using the internet though, so I do want to improve my home network.

So to the point of this: I'm a noob but have done a tiny bit of research and found about CAKE SQM. Can I install this on my RT-AC66U B1? If not, which routers do I need to buy to install it on? My main priority is gaming so I don't need no fancy stuff, just the lowest Bufferbloat/latency I can without sacrificing my download/upload speed much.
 

ColinTaylor

Part of the Furniture
Okay cool, so do I install FexQOS like that other poster said or is CAKE better? I'm a bit confused. I want to use the one that has the lowest Bufferbloat/latency/jitter for gaming.
Your router doesn't support cake so it's not an option for you.
 

bbunge

Part of the Furniture
So I can install FlexQOS on my current router? How do I do this?

Also I'm willing to upgrade my router if CAKE is better for gaming, is it better?
What is your Internet bandwidth?
Over the years I found with my AC66U_B1 that the Asus QOS was as good as most of the others. Another option for you is to try John's Fork of Merlin.
 

360NoScoper

Regular Contributor
What is your Internet bandwidth?
Over the years I found with my AC66U_B1 that the Asus QOS was as good as most of the others. Another option for you is to try John's Fork of Merlin.
200 download, supposed to be 20 upload but it's 10 most of the time.

ASUS QOS, is this the adaptive QOS? If so, only reason I avoided that was because of the TrendMicro concerns. Which is better? Adaptive QOS or bandwidth limiter for gaming?

Also what's a "John's fork"? Sorry if I'm asking a lot of noob questions.
 

ColinTaylor

Part of the Furniture
First you need to understand the problem you're trying to fix, if indeed you even have a problem.

QoS (of any kind) will help to prioritise traffic when there is contention. So unless you're experiencing an actual problem when someone/something is using the internet while you are gaming (e.g. downloading files, streaming, etc.) QoS will not help you. QoS in itself doesn't "make gaming better".
 

360NoScoper

Regular Contributor
First you need to understand the problem you're trying to fix, if indeed you even have a problem.

QoS (of any kind) will help to prioritise traffic when there is contention. So unless you're experiencing an actual problem when someone/something is using the internet while you are gaming (e.g. downloading files, streaming, etc.) QoS will not help you. QoS in itself doesn't "make gaming better".
I know what QOS is, I have Bufferbloat and latency spikes when family are using their devices. I notice in games worse peakers advantage against me and being shot around corners at peak times when family are using their devices.
 

ColinTaylor

Part of the Furniture
I know what QOS is, I have Bufferbloat and latency spikes when family are using their devices. I notice in games worse peakers advantage against me and being shot around corners at peak times when family are using their devices.
Sorry, just went back and read your initial post and saw that you did mention contention being an issue. Bandwidth limiting tends to do little to improve gaming because gaming is all about latency not bandwidth, so Traditional or Adaptive QoS is likely a better choice.

You said you're with "VM", is that Virgin Media in the UK? If that's the case and you're not getting your full upload speed that sounds like the typical Virgin Media over-subscription problem. As such the majority of your problem is probably outside of your control.

fq_codel is always used for Bandwidth Limiter and Traditional QoS. fq_codel is not compatible with Adaptive QoS.
 

360NoScoper

Regular Contributor
Sorry, just went back and read your initial post and saw that you did mention contention being an issue. Bandwidth limiting tends to do little to improve gaming because gaming is all about latency not bandwidth, so Traditional or Adaptive QoS is likely a better choice.

You said you're with "VM", is that Virgin Media in the UK? If that's the case and you're not getting your full upload speed that sounds like the typical Virgin Media over-subscription problem. As such the majority of your problem is probably outside of your control.

fq_codel is always used for Bandwidth Limiter and Traditional QoS. fq_codel is not compatible with Adaptive QoS.
Ah I see. So I'm best off using Traditional QOS or Adaptive QOS then. I swear I tried Traditional QOS once and still had poor Bufferbloat with latency spikes though.

Yes it's indeed Virgin Media. I guess there's not a lot of improvement I can make, outside of switching ISP. I was thinking of upgrading to BT FTTP. That should be a lot better theoretically.

What type of code does Adaptive QOS use? Also how does CAKE compare to them all?
 

heysoundude

Part of the Furniture
You need to do a little bit more of your own research on the threads here; the answers you seek are within.
But if you are dead set on using CAKE, you'll need to upgrade your router. (you'll still be able to use your current one under AiMesh with Merlin to extend or enhance wifi coverage)
 

360NoScoper

Regular Contributor
You need to do a little bit more of your own research on the threads here; the answers you seek are within.
But if you are dead set on using CAKE, you'll need to upgrade your router. (you'll still be able to use your current one under AiMesh with Merlin to extend or enhance wifi coverage)
Can't you give me a straight forward explanation? I've read threads on this forum and people talk to each other like everyone knows what they're doing. There's no noob explanations or guides I'm aware of.
 

capncybo

Regular Contributor
Can't you give me a straight forward explanation? I've read threads on this forum and people talk to each other like everyone knows what they're doing. There's no noob explanations or guides I'm aware of.
This entire thread was painful to read & somewhat cringe-worthy. The subject of latency is one of the most difficult to explain & often one of the most difficult to solve.
What noobs & gamers need to understand is there is always a certain amount of latency because NOTHING is really possible in real-time.
So depending on your physical distance to the server(s) being used... there will be a delay which gets additional time tacked on depending on various hardware & network congestion or traffic.
+ online games are not typically sending LARGE amounts of data (back-&-forth)... they are more sensitive to expecting the smaller data packets as close to real-time as possible.
However, in your case (as is the case with many other people) you have,
"200 download, supposed to be 20 upload but it's 10 most of the time."
Do you know how easily one connected device or client can saturate all your available 10-20Mbps... the answer is EASILY.
So you are on the right track with enabling a form of QOS but a better solution may in fact be another ISP.
If you stay with the one you have now... you basically need to filter the QOS but indicate that Gaming activity is the HIGHEST Priority.
IMO FlexQOS is doable... but getting irritable or irate because the solution to your problem isn't easy...
Is highly illogical, (to quote Mr. Spock)
 

Tech9

Part of the Furniture
I bought an ASUS RT-AC66U B1

I would replace this router with RT-AX68U. Your existing AC clients will work better with AC Wave 2 radios and with lower latency.

I currently use the bandwidth limiter

Bandwidth Limiter is incompatible with NAT acceleration. This may further increase your latency - all the traffic is processed by the CPU.

I know ISP has an effect on this.

If the ISP is bad (too many people share the same bandwidth), no QoS on your side will help improving the situation, unfortunately.
 

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