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(RtAC-68/86U) Ipad keeps dropping Wifi 5ghz

Discussion in 'ASUS AC Routers & Adapters' started by Cyanix, Oct 10, 2019.

  1. Cyanix

    Cyanix Occasional Visitor

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2013
    Messages:
    16
    Greetings.

    My latest Ipad has trouble staying connected to my 5 Ghz network.
    Wifi keeps dropping every 30 sec/ 1min. Totally random, Actually.

    Tested routers are the RT-AC68U/ RT-AC86U with Merlin firmware 384.13
    I also tested the 68U with an older firmware (380.67) and it's even worse.

    Other devices (other Ipad, Xbox, PC) have no problem staying connected.

    Here's an example of the system log:

    Oct 10 19:12:40 dnsmasq-dhcp[484]: DHCPACK(br0) 192.168.1.8 60:8c:4a:72:be:63 Erics-iPad
    Oct 10 19:13:41 dnsmasq-dhcp[484]: DHCPREQUEST(br0) 192.168.1.8 60:8c:4a:72:be:63
    Oct 10 19:13:41 dnsmasq-dhcp[484]: DHCPACK(br0) 192.168.1.8 60:8c:4a:72:be:63 Erics-iPad
    Oct 10 19:14:41 dnsmasq-dhcp[484]: DHCPREQUEST(br0) 192.168.1.8 60:8c:4a:72:be:63
    Oct 10 19:14:41 dnsmasq-dhcp[484]: DHCPACK(br0) 192.168.1.8 60:8c:4a:72:be:63 Erics-iPad
    ...no Wifi on the Ipad device.

    Oct 10 20:23:49 dnsmasq-dhcp[484]: DHCPACK(br0) 192.168.1.8 60:8c:4a:72:be:63 Erics-iPad
    Oct 10 20:25:44 dnsmasq-dhcp[484]: DHCPREQUEST(br0) 192.168.1.8 60:8c:4a:72:be:63
    Oct 10 20:25:44 dnsmasq-dhcp[484]: DHCPACK(br0) 192.168.1.8 60:8c:4a:72:be:63 Erics-iPad
    Oct 10 20:27:44 dnsmasq-dhcp[484]: DHCPREQUEST(br0) 192.168.1.8 60:8c:4a:72:be:63
    Oct 10 20:27:44 dnsmasq-dhcp[484]: DHCPACK(br0) 192.168.1.8 60:8c:4a:72:be:63 Erics-iPad
    ...no Wifi on the Ipad device.

    And it goes on and on like this until the Ipad totally loses the 5Ghz signal.

    Choosing another control channel/ bandwidth has no effect what so ever.

    I also noted that "Enable WMM No-Acknowledgement", when disabled (i usually have it enabled) seems to alleviate the issue.

    Coula anyone help me ?

    Thanks.

    Eric.
     
    Last edited: Oct 10, 2019
  2. Cyanix

    Cyanix Occasional Visitor

    Joined:
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    Messages:
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    Seems it really was the "Enable WMM No-Acknowledgement" option which made my signal drop for one of my Ipads.

    Now i would have questions:

    1) What does it do exactly ?
    I'm aware about the Tcp ack delay in computers network stack and the way it works.
    Is this the same ?

    2) Why is only one of my Ipads that's affected, and not both ? (could argue about IOS version).
     
    Last edited: Oct 10, 2019
  3. Greg72

    Greg72 Regular Contributor

    Joined:
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    Location:
    Central Illinois
    Are both 2.4ghz and 5ghz using the same SSID? How far from the Access Point are you using the iPad?

    Enabling WMM no-ack means that packets are always going to be sent and not wait for the other side to say “Hey I got everything okay”. If there are a lot of devices on that particular band and radios aka Access Points, etc on that band, you can end up over-saturating that spectrum.
     
  4. Cyanix

    Cyanix Occasional Visitor

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    Thank you for your reply.

    2.4 and 5ghz are using two separate SSIDs and i'm about 1 meter away from the router.

    What bothers me is that my other devices are perfectly fine with this setting turned ON, while my second Ipad doesn't seem to accept it.

    When all my devices are connected, only one of them, always the same, exhibits this behavior.
     
  5. Greg72

    Greg72 Regular Contributor

    Joined:
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    Location:
    Central Illinois
    I would just leave it disabled. I just enabled WMM No-Ack on my RT-68u. I have an iPad Pro 2018 running iPadOS 13.x beta and watching Hulu on the smart tv with no issues. If you want to see what is going on RF wise, find a local Ham radio operator that has a scanner to see if anything is causing leakage in that area that your AP Band is on.
     
  6. Cyanix

    Cyanix Occasional Visitor

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2013
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    I tried one last router swap (68=>86) and the 86 lets me turn the option on without issue with an older firmware version (384.11_2).

    Still, i consider the 86 to be a piece of crap (no offense), so 'im looking for a worthy replacement for the 68U.
     
  7. follower

    follower Regular Contributor

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2014
    Messages:
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    Netgear R7800 or AX3000.
     
    Cyanix likes this.
  8. follower

    follower Regular Contributor

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    The current price for R7800 is too expensive. A lot of websites sell it for $140 frequently. Wait for Black Friday.
     
  9. dlandiss

    dlandiss Senior Member

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    Location:
    St. Louis, MO
    I have seen recommendations:

    WMM Support: ON especially if Apple devices need WiFi

    WMM APSD: ON unless mobile devices drop off

    Implicit/Universal Beamforming off

    Airtime fairness off

    (These were generic, actual names in an ASUS router may vary.)
     
  10. Cyanix

    Cyanix Occasional Visitor

    Joined:
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    Update:

    Apparently, all my Apple products exhibit this problem as soon as they're off the charger. (multiple, repeated DHCP requests, then often loss of 5Ghz signal).

    This is only happening on the RT-AC68U, regardless of the firmware.
    It does not happen on the RT-AC86U.

    But then again, i always feel my connections/ internet more snappy on the RT68, even with the same settings.

    So, considering i'm not planning to buy a Netgear 7800, because:
    1) i'm not into Netgear, tried it years ago, didn't like it.
    2)the 7800 would be a sidegrade to my 86

    I'd want something more powerful and robust than a 86, possibly a quad core. What would you guys suggest ?

    *edit:
    Something that lets me enjoy my full Gigabit line speed with Adaptative QoS/ FQ_codel enabled*
     
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2019
  11. Val D.

    Val D. Senior Member

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    Quad-core version of the same hardware is in RT-AX88U router - 4 x 1.8GHz CPU and 1GB RAM. The price for this router is double too. Keep in mind some processes are single core only, like OpenVPN. You may have no benefit of quad-core CPU over dual-core. For that reason RT-AC86U and RT-AX88U have the same VPN performance.

    And why you need to run QoS on a Gigabit line? On my 300Mbps line QoS on/off doesn't make much of a difference.
    You can enjoy your full speed Gigabit line with wired clients only. You won't see Gigabit throughput on any wireless client, for now.
     
  12. Cyanix

    Cyanix Occasional Visitor

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    Thanks for answering.

    I do know that wireless devices cannot get (for now) gigabit throughput, even more so when coupled with QoS.

    Even if my ISP line is 1 Gbit, most of my devices are wireless and as stated before, they're far from getting maximum throughput.

    Bottom line is: i want to establish a hierarchy for the connections. Some devices clearly not require as much bandwith as others, who need absolute priority.

    As it is, Asus/Merlin Adaptative/traditional/Bandwith limiter QoS simply cuts my throughput in half.
     
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2019 at 3:42 PM
  13. coxhaus

    coxhaus Part of the Furniture

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    If your QoS speeds are that low maybe the line speed for QoS is set too low. I don't know ASUS but that seems low.
     
  14. Cyanix

    Cyanix Occasional Visitor

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    I just ran several speed test.

    I tried multiple values for the base speed when tweaking my QoS.
    (950/900/850/800)

    Rt-Ac68u:
    Ethernet/QoS off: ~800 Mb/s
    Ethernet/QoS on : 400-410 Mb/s
    WIFI QoS off: 460-500 Mb/s
    WIFI QoS on: ~400 Mb/s

    Rt-Ac86u:
    Ethernet/QoS off: ~840 Mb/s
    Ethernet/QoS on : 560-600 Mb/s
    WIFI QoS off: 460-500 Mb/s
    WIFI QoS on: 430-500 Mb/s

    Result was the same for each and every value i entered for bandwidth settings

    That's why i was enquiring about a more powerful (cpu-wise) router than the 86U, but it seems wae cannot at this day get full gigabit speed and QoS at the same time. At least not on consumer hardware.


    But that's beyond the point.

    My issue was 5Ghz signal loss with the rt-ac68U and my Ipads.
     
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2019 at 3:43 PM
  15. Grisu

    Grisu Part of the Furniture

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    but still there is no need or benefit using QoS on lines >300Mb/s, what do you think to get better with it turned on? It only can do worse.
     
  16. coxhaus

    coxhaus Part of the Furniture

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    I would say that is true at any home environment. If you get to a bigger small business then you might find QoS helps especially if you run IP phones. But I would do QoS in the switches for IP phones not the router.
     
  17. Grisu

    Grisu Part of the Furniture

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    that may be or better is correct, but for business even small ones you should upgrade customer routers to something more reliable.
     
  18. Val D.

    Val D. Senior Member

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    Then just connect slower devices to the 2.4GHz network, they will be physically limited to 50-70Mbps. :)
     
  19. sfx2000

    sfx2000 Part of the Furniture

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    Are you on IOS (now IpadOS 13)?

    Which iPad?

    There's been odd stuff happening across the latest upgrade there...

    My iPhone 6s - iOS 13 has been a bit of a challenge for connectivity and applications - heck, sometimes incoming phone calls don't ring the phone app.
     
  20. Cyanix

    Cyanix Occasional Visitor

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    Ipad pro 10.5 IOS 12.2

    Not upgrading to Ipad OS yet.