Workshop network design/config question(s)

[RetractableRoof66]

Hi Folks,

I apologize for the newbie type question(s), and the fact I'm going to need an "explain like I'm 5" answer.

Scenario:
I've got a small portable CNC machine that I communicate with via a Windows 8.1 laptop. I've got a simple (old) DLink router next to the CNC direct connected via ethernet wire. The CNC has been configured with a static IP address. I connect wirelessly to the router (SSID: CNCRouter), communicate to the CNC by setting up my laptop to view the CNC as an IP printer. So far everything is good. I'm alone on the router, and have no internet access in the workshop. And there's the rub. I often need internet access to do what needs to be done while the CNC is slaving away. To do that, I set my phone up as a hotspot, and connect my laptop to the phone to perform internet related tasks - until I need to interact with the CNC again. Back and forth, back and forth. I'd like to create a scenario where I can access the internet and the CNC machine simultaneously.

Related/Sub Scenarios:

• I sometimes take the CNC (and router) to a friends shop to work with him designing and creating things, and we often need to use the internet for reference photos, files, etc. He's got internet access in his shop - again, it would be nice to be able to make a quick change/adjustment to whatever equipment and have my laptop again be able to connect to his internet and still see the CNC machine without flipping back and forth between network connections.
• I also have a large library of sporadically used CNC files, backups, graphics resources, archives, etc. that I would love to be able to plug into the CNCRouter / some device and have it available without tying up 600-700 GB of space on the laptop drive. For the most part this library is only needed when I am using the CNC and so I'd love to leave the hardrive plugged into whatever small network or setup I am creating. The old CNCRouter doesn't have a USB port for this currently - so if I have to replace the router with another piece of equipment, then maybe this goal comes along for free.
• I'd love to be able to throw a portable laser printer on this network/setup as well.
• If my friend and I both want to communicate with the CNC on this new setup, it would be nice if we could exchange files back and forth without needing a thumb drive. I'll keep my virus software up to date.

Questions:
How the hell do I set this up? I feel like I am missing some simple approach that would enable me to accomplish this goal. What additional equipment do I need in order to get there? If I need to install something different/more on the CNCRouter (DDWRT?) to get me there, I'm willing to do so. It's a $10 yard sale router - worst that can happen is I brick it, right? lol Do I need an Extender? A bridge? A clue? Actually don't answer the last one.

I appreciate anyone taking the time to even bother reading this. Answers/suggestions gratefully received. This is an annoyance to be sure, and depending on the tasks of the day - it gets into frustrating territory - mostly because I forget to flip the networks back and forth, and can't figure out why the damn CNC isn't working properly.

If I've left out important info, let me know - I don't have the router model number handy - it's a basic older DLink router that isn't supported anymore. lol

Thanks again,
RR66

 

[dosborne]

How the hell do I set this up?

Many different approaches and solutions. It comes down to how much you want to spend.

For internet access, first step is to investigate your ISP options in your area. Easiest solution is likely to get a router from them (or get your own - the current DLink *may* work, but you at least want to run reasonably recent firmware for security reasons). It will come down to internet speed and what you want to pay. You are essentially using the DLink as a wired to wireless bridge so any new device would easily handle that for you and replace the DLink.

If your laptop has an ethernet port, chances are you could do away with the DLink now, although it doesn't hurt to use it.

some device and have it available without tying up 600-700 GB of space

Pretty minimal requirements by today's standards. A 2TB+ external usb drive can be found sub-$100 in most areas. If you have money to burn, a simple NAS drive would make it independent from your laptop as an option too.

throw a portable laser printer on this network/

Most printers are network-ready these days, unlike the old serial or parallel interface devices of last century

my friend and I both want to communicate with the CNC on this new setup

Depending on the router you choose, and the network storage option, setting up a VPN would allow your friend, or you remotely, to access your network remotely as if you were there. You could either "share" the usb drive on your laptop (requiring it to be "on" to work) or use a NAS device (essentially a tiny PC with a shared drive(s) that sits on your hetwork) and provides file storage. The CNC would continue to be used as a network printer accessed via IP address.

All pretty easy to do, and not all that expensive for some basic options.

 

[dosborne]

To do that, I set my phone up as a hotspot, and connect my laptop to the phone to perform internet related tasks

If your laptop has an ethernet port, or you get either a wireless or wired usb network adapter, then you could access both the internet via your phone's hotspot and the CNC machine at the same time. This would solve one issue without having to pay an ISP, but wouldn't be feasible for most of your other requirements.

Cloud storage is another option for both your saved files and for sharing files with your friend.

 

[dosborne]

I sometimes take the CNC (and router) to a friends shop to work with him designing and creating things, and we often need to use the internet for reference photos, files, etc. He's got internet access in his shop - again, it would be nice to be able to make a quick change/adjustment to whatever equipment and have my laptop again be able to connect to his internet and still see the CNC machine without flipping back and forth between network connections.

One simple "fix" for that would be to change the static IP address of the CNC machine to match *his* network subnet. You wouldn't need your dlink in that scenario. Just connect it direct, and connect your laptop to his network. If you change your network IP addresses to match his, then moving back and forth is just a matter of connecting to one or the other.

Bottom line, all your goals are easily handled. Summary:

- change the static IP on the CNC either permanently (best option) or temporarily when going between your network and your friends. Forget the DLink when on his network, it just complicates things.
- use a usb drive, a NAS drive or cloud storage to handle the CNC backup files.
- get a printer that will connect either wirelessly or wired to your network.
- cloud storage or VPN will allow you to share files.
- use the ethernet port, or get a usb adapter, to connect your laptop to both the internet (via hotspot) and your CNC device, or get internet service.

 

[RetractableRoof66]

Wow, dosborne, that was quick. Thank you.

1) I'm OK with the phone as a hotspot for internet - the volume/speed are ok, for what I am doing in general. It is the mechanics of simultaneous access that I am struggling with. Same when visiting the friend, his internet access is more than adequate. The laptop DOES have an ethernet port - I think you are heading towards just connecting the laptop to the CNC/CNCRouter with an ethernet cable and then use the internet wirelessly as I currently am. The issue with that is that I move around the shop with the laptop a bit, and I like to keep the laptop away from the destruction zone as much as possible due to the sawdust etc. that gets generated. From that perspective, I thought wireless to the router was a net positive - am I wrong?
2) I just purchased a 1 TB USB hard drive and am off loading files to it. Can I assume a new(er) router with a USB port will allow me to access the drive within the CNCRouter network? I did consider (and still might use) cloud storage for the data - but at the shop it just makes sense to have physical access to the data. I think in terms of daily access to the data, the cloud makes more sense if/when I bring an ISP into the mix.
3) OK, then I will join the current century (maybe decade if I am feeling up to it) and get a network aware printer Do I do anything fun router side to make sure the printer is always on the same IP address for the laptop to find it? If this is out of the scope of the site, no worries.
4) A VPN seems like a smart solution if I create permanent internet access at the shop. If I should reconsider that part of it, I will take this advice then.
5) Changing the CNC IP configuration to match the subnet of his network sounds doable. I should have thought of that, but mostly have considered the CNC config to be in the "it's working, don't mess with it" category. It's not a complicated change, and adds value.

And woah... 6)

[...] or you get either a wireless or wired usb network adapter, then you could access both the internet via your phone's hotspot and the CNC machine at the same time. [...]

I didn't know this was possible! I thought I needed a bridge(?) or something fancy... I can have two wireless devices on one laptop simultaneously!?! Once I connect the USB internet device to the laptop (I'd use that one to talk to the internet), do I need to flip any settings to go back and forth? Or is it seamless from that perspective? Are there any gotchas to the mechanics of doing this? I mean, if this is as easy as it sounds, I'll be doing this today...

Thank you again for taking the time to answer (multiple times actually) and provide all the options and info that you did. It is appreciated.

 

[dosborne]

The laptop DOES have an ethernet port - I think you are heading towards just connecting the laptop to the CNC/CNCRouter with an ethernet cable and then use the internet wirelessly as I currently am. The issue with that is that I move around the shop with the laptop a bit, and I like to keep the laptop away from the destruction zone as much as possible due to the sawdust etc. that gets generated. From that perspective, I thought wireless to the router was a net positive - am I wrong?

Keeping the laptop in a "clean" area of the shop is never a bad idea. However, only you can decide what works best for the setup and budget.
Using the ethernet port to connect directly to the CNC machine (not the CNC Router as you call it) would allow you to simplify your setup by removing the need for the old insecure DLink. However, the dlink does give you portability and access from a distance allowing you to keep your laptop away from the dust.

I didn't know this was possible! I thought I needed a bridge(?) or something fancy... I can have two wireless devices on one laptop simultaneously!?! Once I connect the USB internet device to the laptop (I'd use that one to talk to the internet), do I need to flip any settings to go back and forth? Or is it seamless from that perspective? Are there any gotchas to the mechanics of doing this? I mean, if this is as easy as it sounds, I'll be doing this today...

Thinking about this a bit more, you don't really need to bridge the 2 connections (for basic operation, but you would if you go the VPN route). To be sure about the bridging, google and read up on Microsoft Internet Connection Sharing which is the tech behind it. Not sure which version they introduced it in. But yes, using one adapter you could connect wirelessly to the dlink (and access your CNC machine) and using another adapter you could connect to your phone wifi hotspot. This should be pretty seamless from the laptop perspective.

2) I just purchased a 1 TB USB hard drive and am off loading files to it. Can I assume a new(er) router with a USB port will allow me to access the drive within the CNCRouter network? I did consider (and still might use) cloud storage for the data - but at the shop it just makes sense to have physical access to the data. I think in terms of daily access to the data, the cloud makes more sense if/when I bring an ISP into the mix.

Although I would not personally recommend it, in theory, you could attach the drive to a (new) router and "share" it on your small network. Since you would be the only one able to access it, or the only one who would need to access it, it would be better and more efficient to connect it to your laptop directly. If you connect it to a router, you *may* have to reformat it with a different file system and copy all the files again

Cloud storage would really only benefit you by:
- Giving you access to these files without the need to have a external drive at all
- Giving you access to these (provided you have internet access) locally
- Giving you access to these file when at your friends
- Giving your friend access to copy/move/share files with you via the cloud instead of physical transfer

Do I do anything fun router side to make sure the printer is always on the same IP address for the laptop to find it?

The software that comes with it should handle all that easily. For "infrastructure" devices such as servers, printers, switches, I personally prefer static IP addresses, but again, the software should work just fine with dynamic (DHCP) addressing (where the IP could change). Depending on your router (which would run the DHCP server) you can also set it to always assign the same IP if the printer asks for an address (I do this this even with static IPs set on the devices as a fallback). Most printers give you the option of a wired or wireless connection and it is really more a convenience, portability factor than anything else. Speed won't be all that different for most applications (I do personally prefer wired connections for a variety or not terribly important reasons).

A VPN seems like a smart solution if I create permanent internet access at the shop. If I should reconsider that part of it, I will take this advice then.

Yup, no point in rushing into it all at once. Take your time and make the various changes.

Thank you again for taking the time to answer (multiple times actually) and provide all the options and info that you did. It is appreciated.

Happy to help where I can as are most people here.