For any one who upgraded to Windows 10, READ THIS!!!!
- Thread starter pinkfloyd1173
- Start date
AdvHomeServer
Senior Member
The remark about 'Enterprise Android' was an attempt at sarcasm. Google is a marketing machine and access to anonymous and /or personal info is easy for them to get if you're not aware of it. Enterprise Android would make Google a part of the enterprise using it, hypothetically. With Win10 emulating Google as a miner of user oriented data, I took a leap of logic and wondered if Win Server, by comparison, might start resembling Google Android in some ways. Thus my concern about companies now having to expend time and money just to keep MS out of their business where it wasn't specifically invited. BTW, Win10 Pro can join a domain and a lot of companies don't use Enterprise level releases. It's also more likely that Win10 Enterprise will have additional features such as DirectAcccess or BranchCache, rather than edited features.
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sfx2000
Part of the Furniture
That's ok... sarcasm noted, but at the same time, folks are wondering about this, and there are those in the android ecosystem that would like to break into the enterprise market - lockin is a strong incentive, and the path to good recurring revenue - to whit - Blackberry...
Android is - as it's closely related to Linux - folks do watch what's happening there...
But Android isn't Linux, and there are those in the Linux community that totally reject Android - what's funny is that many of those that I've talked to have an iFondleSlab in their pocket, or writing code on a shiny aluminum laptop forged in the spirit of Steve Jobs...
Oh well...
FWIW - Over the last couple of year, and more importantly, in the last 12 months - I can appreciate that MSFT has refocused on what is important - and we're seeing some great software and services as a result - and Win10/Windows in general is not my primary platform...
azazel1024
Very Senior Member
SharePoint is a steaming bucket of poo...but that steaming bucket of poo really does make work a hell of a lot better. Even if it was coded by schizophrenic elderly monkeys.
azazel1024
Very Senior Member
I think "enterprise" android would need to be a completely different product and or paradigm for it to work. Android's biggest issue right now is the 3-tier market that Google was okay with to get market share. You have Google writing the base code, but then you have the handset makers and then the telecoms all playing with the OS code base to put their own spin on it. If a bug is found, Google has to fix it, then the OEM has to touch it and then the telecom. If you are lucky and you have a tablet, you can generally leave the Telecom out of it, if it doesn't have a modem in it.
That still means lots of hands touching it and Google is really the only one with any vested interest in fixing the issues. The OEMs want to sell you more devices, so if what you have it broken, sounds good to them.
Based on history since smart phones came about. Apple seems to have roughly a 4-6 years support cycle on their devices with critical flaws generally addressed within 2-8 weeks. Android seems to have roughly a 2 year support cycle at BEST and often times closer to 1 year. Critical flaws are often fixed within 3-5 months on the whole (oh, sure, Google might fix it within 2-4 weeks, but a lot of times the OEMs and then the telecoms hold it up for another 2-8wks each). Occasionally you might be lucky with a truly destructive bug being found that they might roll out the fix within just a couple of weeks for android, but that is very uncommon...and often times you'll only see the fix in the latest point release (the last 2 or 3 point releases if you are lucky)...but you probably are screwed because your phone is 18 months old and your OEM still hasn't upgraded to the latest (or even 1-2 point releases back) release of android.
Don't get me wrong, I generally like my kid's Asus android 7" tablets. Especially as a budget device they are very good. As a high end device, not so much. I mostly like Android OS how it is setup, for a touch device. However, the fact that bug fixes and critical security flaws are going to continue to be back burnered until something radical changes in the Android paradigm, never for a phone for me.
Your best bet, if you can, is to get an unlocked bootloader phone and load an alt Android on it that probably will be much better supported by the developers. That covers maybe .5% of all Android users.
AdvHomeServer
Senior Member
A little off topic but relevant to your comment: As I mentioned earlier, I just bought a factory refurb 12 inch Samsung Tab Pro tablet. It really flies. Add a keyboard and mouse and it's a desktop / laptop substitute for a lot of purposes. I have some big plans for it down the road, but I first need to re-learn linux to the point of comfort. (I'm thinking of installing a central windows or linux machine or VM. Tablets / phones will perform most of what I normally do, but TeamViewer into the box/VM from the tablets / phones will do the rest. I'll see how practical this is in a few months. It may seem a little out-there today, but I suspect semi-centralized home computing will be more common in a few years. 'The home cloud' is how it will be marketed.)
This purchases gave me the freedom to experiment with my elderly Motorola Xoom tablet. I rooted it, re-sized the system partition so it could load Android 4.4 and proceeded to install Omni 4.4.4. My first hack. This OS enabled me to overclock the processor from 1.0GHz to 1.5GHz. It is stable and no longer seems geriatric. To the downside, the Tegra 2 won't work with some of the better programs (MS Office for Android as an example), so it's not a perfect tablet, just a faster one that snaps when I ask it to. Right now, it's mostly a spare desktop TV via a Slingbox App, including a powered Xoom stand with speakers I found on Amazon for cheap.
Thinking ahead, the router - NAS model is dated. In 2010 it was state of the art. Today it's mature tech and a 'home cloud' that mom and pop feel comfortable with is the next thing. That concept is bleeding edge today, but wait 5 years. The tech needed for this is not desktop Windows or Linux, except possibly in the back room by the router. My above mentioned project is just scratching the surface of what will come from the industry in a few years.
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L&LD
Part of the Furniture
When I am suspicious of a new setting, I do not consult the manufacturer (MS in this case), as I assume they will lie. A 10 second google search brought up the right response: disable it.
My stance over the past many years is to not ever let employees access a business network with anything other than a paid for and internally supported device and OS that has been tested and setup by a trusted process.
The OS in this case needs to be Windows 10 Enterprise which can be properly locked down. But even an employee that has their own Windows 10 Enterprise computer would never run it close to any system I support with my approval.
I disable everything, including Cortana, when setting up new systems. Privacy and security is not something new to do. It just seems to require more steps with each new OS.
sfx2000
Part of the Furniture
Good points...
Challenges with BYOD - not impossible to deal with, but it does present opportunities for IT to support BYOD and keep data and network security still in place - some of this is via AD profiles, policies (both written and AD enforced), and the big one that can be a significant concern is commingling of personal and business data, which is a huge risk for both employees and the company.
VDI, along with RDS, is an option to consider, where actual work is done in a virtualized environment.
Another is a solution like VMWare or Parallels, where an Image file is present, and that's where the work is done - I did that for the longest time, having Win7 Enterprise attached to the domain, licensed SW ran in the VM, and no sharing between the host and the VM (which can be done via policy controls).
For Tablets/Smartphones - probably best to issue a Company Official Use device, and with profiles/policies/certs in place, access to business apps is probably ok - for Personal devices that folks bring to the office, better to sandbox them over to a seperate WLAN/VLAN, and again, not allow the streams to cross...
And that's probably how Win10 should be handled for the interim - Windows tablets are cheap, and they're getting Win10.. and AD can detect them when they try to attach to the domain, and boot them off...
just my $0.02...
htismaqe
Very Senior Member
I can't speak to anyone else's customers, but my customers just wouldn't stand for that approach. They're trying to recruit Fortune 100 talent and Fortune 100 talent has a certain level of expectation about the work environment. You can't ban BYOD and disable dozens of features on their devices and expect them to be happy - they'll just go work for your competitor across the street.
In what other industry would you hear someone say this and still buy the product? I certainly can't think of any.
In what other industry would you hear someone say this and still buy the product? I certainly can't think of any.
azazel1024
Very Senior Member
At least with enterprise, one thing to keep in mind, unless I have completely missed something, the wifisense thing does NOT work with WPA2 enterprise. IE if you are using RADIUS, wifisense isn't going to work.
L&LD
Part of the Furniture
No doubt, but I am not catering to F100 companies in my neck of the woods.
As there are not too many choices about using one OS or another if certain programs are a given (Office, for example), this may be a special industry. But that doesn't mean I have to believe what the horse is telling me.
Third party verification is (or should be) a given. And I especially welcome it when my customers do it to me and then tell me why they decided to proceed one way or another (and then, I make sure I get that statement in writing).
To be clear; when I mean lie, MS, google, facebook, etc. means 'end user benefit'. But it doesn't matter how you paint it; it is still a lie.
Windows 10 is designed for 'normal' users with the defaults it chooses (i.e. make it easier to get all the features / benefits it offers). But, that doesn't mean that kind of thinking ever applies to me or my customers. A new OS gives me (and them) a faster, modern and more stable base to do our work with. It isn't a way to share cat videos.
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sfx2000
Part of the Furniture
So going back to BYOD - it really comes down to the use case and the employee's role..
"Least Access" is probably a fair term - Small/Medium Enterprises will have to face that people will bring equipment in, also 3rd Parties like Vendors and such...
In a call center or Point of Sale - that's something that BYOD probably isn't a good thing to run business on - at the same time, other functions, they may have limited access - many of our Apps for example, are not desktop based and can work fine within a browser based world.
"Least Access" is probably a fair term - Small/Medium Enterprises will have to face that people will bring equipment in, also 3rd Parties like Vendors and such...
In a call center or Point of Sale - that's something that BYOD probably isn't a good thing to run business on - at the same time, other functions, they may have limited access - many of our Apps for example, are not desktop based and can work fine within a browser based world.
AdvHomeServer
Senior Member
Very true. If I ever install win10, I will turn it on. My pfSense router has a radius server package. DD-WRT has one that's easy to use. QNAP offers one. Most other routers don't. So much for WPA2 Enterprise for them.
As Merlin noted, if MS applied a little salesmanship and offered an opt-in, a lot of people would accept, happily. Sync can be useful.
The company that assumed Win 8 charms, no start menu, and more need to be shoved down user's throats will never show even simple sensitivity towards this issue. Lots of windows evangelists who have livelihoods that depend on MS good graces will patronize those with concerns. Complaints such as mine are pi**ing in the wind, but these things need to be said. I do not expect MS to lighten up even a little. They have no need. It's Win10, eventually, or don't use your computer. By then, easy privacy apps will be common. Classic Shell for Win 8 is a parallel.
htismaqe
Very Senior Member
I wouldn't be so sure. Microsoft has caved twice with the Xbox One, first with the always-online component and then again with the bundled Kinect. They're listening to consumers but the uproar has to be large and loud.
AdvHomeServer
Senior Member
1) As I predicted ... lots of options for Win10 privacy:
http://www.ghacks.net/2015/08/14/comparison-of-windows-10-privacy-tools/
2) Relearning linux with the intention of replacing Win8 on a small laptop and never going to win10. Long term project to replace Windows entirely eventually. openSuse seems to be a good compromise for me. Does linux have a virtual desktop program / server, as opposed to a remote desktop? By virtual, I mean it appears on demand when you remotely sign in and is there as you left it when you remotely sign in again. A thin client. I read articles about Chromebox apps maybe doing this from afar into the home server. I understand the value of QNAP Virtualization Server now. I might look into it or something more powerful later if I build a home mainframe (I mean home cloud server). (Edit: Just found some VNC oriented programs that claim to do this. Will give them a try when I get ready for remote login. Any more suggestions welcome. SSH does character - will it do wysiwyg?)
3) Edit: More work yet to be done: https://thehackernews.com/2015/08/windows-10-privacy-spying.html
http://www.ghacks.net/2015/08/14/comparison-of-windows-10-privacy-tools/
2) Relearning linux with the intention of replacing Win8 on a small laptop and never going to win10. Long term project to replace Windows entirely eventually. openSuse seems to be a good compromise for me. Does linux have a virtual desktop program / server, as opposed to a remote desktop? By virtual, I mean it appears on demand when you remotely sign in and is there as you left it when you remotely sign in again. A thin client. I read articles about Chromebox apps maybe doing this from afar into the home server. I understand the value of QNAP Virtualization Server now. I might look into it or something more powerful later if I build a home mainframe (I mean home cloud server). (Edit: Just found some VNC oriented programs that claim to do this. Will give them a try when I get ready for remote login. Any more suggestions welcome. SSH does character - will it do wysiwyg?)
3) Edit: More work yet to be done: https://thehackernews.com/2015/08/windows-10-privacy-spying.html
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L&LD
Part of the Furniture
AdvHomeServer,
Easy to attack the side of that big barn called MS and Windows, but where are the reviews and counterpoints to using and depending on the utilities that are being praised in that article?
I do agree that if features are turned off, they should be off completely. But I also know that if I want to keep communicating with and staying current for my customers I have to give up some of the control I had in the past.
We are already a connected society and that comes with certain tradeoffs. There is no other OS that will offer similar functionality at a higher level of security today or in the near future.
Going back to Linux is like re-inventing the wheel. I'm too old to do that, again.
And any version of Linux I've tried has failed to impress me enough to even install it on metal.
Easy to attack the side of that big barn called MS and Windows, but where are the reviews and counterpoints to using and depending on the utilities that are being praised in that article?
I do agree that if features are turned off, they should be off completely. But I also know that if I want to keep communicating with and staying current for my customers I have to give up some of the control I had in the past.
We are already a connected society and that comes with certain tradeoffs. There is no other OS that will offer similar functionality at a higher level of security today or in the near future.
Going back to Linux is like re-inventing the wheel. I'm too old to do that, again.
And any version of Linux I've tried has failed to impress me enough to even install it on metal.
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