IOT devices / How do the SNB members set them up at home?

[bodean]

Currently have a Ubquiti network at home (2 APS, Switch, and Edgerouter).
I have 2 SSID's setup, 1 main one (5/2.4ghz) and one that I made for IOT devices.

I am just wondering if this is overkill in a home environment or not. I am trying to get a firewall ruleset together for the IOT network. The IOT SSID network is on a separate subnet/vlan from my house network.

What do other on here do with their IOT devices at home, and how do they integrate them into your home network?

 

[CaptainSTX]

I run my IoT devices on a different subnet and for those that use WiFi I have them connected to one of the six guest networks I have enabled which restrict their access to the Intranet. I use multiple guest SSIDs so if a dumb IoT device gets hacked hopefully fewer IoT devices will be impacted. I also use a VPN for those IoT devices that work OK when using a VPN. This results in my network having at least three public IPs (IP from local ISP, IP for VPN for IoT devices and IP for non IoT devices.)

This is probably over kill but I do it because I can.

 

[System Error Message]

for us more skilled/experienced bunch, we dont set up IoT, we make our own and dont use the IoT standard or ways that are full of holes and vulnerabilities. No port forwarding, no remote server, any access needed via VPN. Ofcourse any networked sensors would be on a different layer 2 and 3 network.

You are not overkill, infact i will say that you are under equipped. I dont see any mini servers to manage your IOT devices, something like a raspberry pi to a full blown linux server not only managing the devices but also performing network security too. Those tiny devices should not connect to the internet.

 

[CaptainSTX]

= Those tiny devices should not connect to the internet.

Some IoT devices would not be useful if they could not connect to the Internet. For example, no point in having an Amazon Dash button to reorder a specific item if it can't send a blurb of data to Amazon's servers. It has some security built in as it can't place another order until the first order has been delivered and it immeadiately notifies you by e-mail that an order has been placed and gives you thirty minutes to cancel the order and even if you didn't cancel Amazon has a liberal return policy.[/QUOTE]

 

[bodean]

Interesting discussion. Thanks for the insight.

 

[sfx2000]

Currently have a Ubquiti network at home (2 APS, Switch, and Edgerouter).
I have 2 SSID's setup, 1 main one (5/2.4ghz) and one that I made for IOT devices.

I am just wondering if this is overkill in a home environment or not. I am trying to get a firewall ruleset together for the IOT network. The IOT SSID network is on a separate subnet/vlan from my house network.

Pretty much the same thing here -- only difference is that IoT is on a dedicated AP, and the hosting VLAN also does my sketchy Android TV box and DirecTV internet access...

 

[hedly]

Man, that whole IoT genre is a little scary. I keep looking at it and just can't bring myself to include any in my home. And I'm not some old guy who grew up on slide-rulers. I grew up on computers and (aside from using them daily for project management and email) work on some state of the art technology.

I've considered building an Alexa or Google home type device with my son, but my wife has no interest or desire to have one in the home. And then I realize that my phone does most of that stuff anyway; so why do I need something that ONLY does that.

I do have a question for @sfx2000 and @System Error Message (and @CaptainSTX ). What IoT devices do you have at home?

The reason I ask is as I said above. I'm looking for a fun science project to do with my son to introduce him to programming and computer-ing. He's 11 and is just starting to figure out word and a little powerpoint. Please don't lecture me on how I'm late to getting him on computers. I look at where I am and what I'm doing and figure he could wait another 2 years and still have plenty of experience on them.

Anyway, I am truly interested in what IoT devices you all use. CaptainSTX (sorry to hijack your thread), you mentioned the Dash buttons. I'm interested in things beyond that as I have no issue with going online to order stuff.

 

[sfx2000]

I do have a question for @sfx2000 and @System Error Message (and @CaptainSTX ). What IoT devices do you have at home?

I've got a smart thermostat and a doorbell - that and the other stuff I mentioned above - that VLAN is also my sandbox for the work computer (business, don't cross the streams) and some hobby stuff...

The reason I ask is as I said above. I'm looking for a fun science project to do with my son to introduce him to programming and computer-ing. He's 11 and is just starting to figure out word and a little powerpoint. Please don't lecture me on how I'm late to getting him on computers. I look at where I am and what I'm doing and figure he could wait another 2 years and still have plenty of experience on them.

Cool - Raspberry Pi is obviously a good place to start, and sounds like your son is just at the right age to explore and enjoy. Get a Pi3 B+ and a sense hat - a lot of schools are using Pi's in their STEM curriculum paths, so might not hurt to check in with the school and see what they're doing there.

The Raspbian distro pretty much has everything one needs to get started with learning how to code, from Python/Python3 to Java to a full on programming environment... Mathematica is a nice touch as well.

Sense Hat has a lot to offer, and strong code support within the Raspberry Pi community... and it hits many of the IoT kind of buttons...

• 8×8 RGB LED matrix
• five-button joystick
• Gyroscope
• Accelerometer
• Magnetometer
• Temperature
• Barometric pressure
• Humidity

See the pic below - notice that it does keep the camera connector free, so that is something you can add later on...

 

[System Error Message]

Man, that whole IoT genre is a little scary. I keep looking at it and just can't bring myself to include any in my home. And I'm not some old guy who grew up on slide-rulers. I grew up on computers and (aside from using them daily for project management and email) work on some state of the art technology.

I've considered building an Alexa or Google home type device with my son, but my wife has no interest or desire to have one in the home. And then I realize that my phone does most of that stuff anyway; so why do I need something that ONLY does that.

I do have a question for @sfx2000 and @System Error Message (and @CaptainSTX ). What IoT devices do you have at home?

The reason I ask is as I said above. I'm looking for a fun science project to do with my son to introduce him to programming and computer-ing. He's 11 and is just starting to figure out word and a little powerpoint. Please don't lecture me on how I'm late to getting him on computers. I look at where I am and what I'm doing and figure he could wait another 2 years and still have plenty of experience on them.

Anyway, I am truly interested in what IoT devices you all use. CaptainSTX (sorry to hijack your thread), you mentioned the Dash buttons. I'm interested in things beyond that as I have no issue with going online to order stuff.

Raspberry Pi, arduino, thinkerboards, basically DIY stuff.

 

[hedly]

Thanks @sfx2000 and @System Error Message. The tough part I've had is figuring out what to make that actually DOES something. The idea of making a weather station (temp, pressure, humidity) is certainly intriguing. I could set that up on a back building where I could power it have have either hard wired ethernet or use the wifi.

But I want it to do something. Otherwise he'll make it and it will just sit there.

System Error Message, do you have any ideas?

Also, @bodean, are you just planning on using the canned IoT's (like Dash buttons) or do you have other plans?

 

[sfx2000]

But I want it to do something. Otherwise he'll make it and it will just sit there.

True, true...

You need to find an itch to scratch... a problem to be solved

https://www.raspberrypi.org/magpi/issues/projects-1/
https://www.raspberrypi.org/magpi/issues/projects-2/
https://www.raspberrypi.org/magpi/issues/projects-3/
https://www.raspberrypi.org/magpi/issues/projects-4/

These are all free PDF downloads...

 

[System Error Message]

Thanks @sfx2000 and @System Error Message. The tough part I've had is figuring out what to make that actually DOES something. The idea of making a weather station (temp, pressure, humidity) is certainly intriguing. I could set that up on a back building where I could power it have have either hard wired ethernet or use the wifi.

But I want it to do something. Otherwise he'll make it and it will just sit there.

System Error Message, do you have any ideas?

Also, @bodean, are you just planning on using the canned IoT's (like Dash buttons) or do you have other plans?

look for a wealth of sensors and accessories sold by various arduino/raspberry pi sellers, there are plenty but you have to browse their websites not marketplaces. Then just find code examples and wiring as well and follow. If going for outdoors, you'll need a weatherproof setup, which you could use plexi and sealent, but more importantly is that it definitely will need some air holes for the air to go in and not overheat but also to measure things.

Plenty of sensors, lights, motors and so on, even camera, you could make your own solar powered arduino/raspberry pi security cam with various sensors and battery backup. Make sure the cam has infrared and is at least 1080p. plenty of things from sensors from GPS and pressure, humidity to various air quality sensors, smoke, CO2, just about anything you want, even flashy RGB square LED lights or motors to mimic your own windmill (not actual but cool looking), just about anything you can think of. First define a function, then design something for it.

 

[hedly]

Thanks for the replies. I'll look into those projects and see if any of it interests my son.

@bodean , thanks for letting me take a little tangent to your thread.

concerning your answer, I think it all comes down to risk. How much risk do you want to put on your network? If an IoT is compromised, what data can the person who did it get to. If you've got a lot of Personally Identifiable Info (PII) on your network, then you probably will want to lock it down pretty hard. If your network is only filled with cat photos or other genre that you can replace, then maybe you don't need to lock it down too hard. (not that I have anything against cats, I used it as a euphemism for common or unimportant data...I dont' have a cat so if I lost any cat photos I wouldn't care).

The other thing to consider is how accessible is the IoT. If it's low powered and you have a large property, then it's unlikely that anyone can even access it. Now, if you live in a highly populated area with a known crowd of skilled people, and the device is on the perimeter of your property. Then you're more likely to become a target.

Hope that helps.