Yes the 11a is on my old laptop. Sfx2000 has answered the question about the iPad air speed increase so it is dual stream. My 5GHz is running 40MHz as there is only one other 5 GHz network around me so my wireless stays at 40MHz. I back up against a city park. The city decided to upgrade their wireless in the park, around the pool and in the community center so I have wireless everywhere around me. It is all open wireless on 2,4GHz so I may try to use it for my outdoors in my back yard. I wonder if I could repeat the signal with a device to gain an antenna in my back yard?
5GHz NA-Mixed?
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azazel1024
Very Senior Member
Awesome list, thanks!
azazel1024
Very Senior Member
You could, but I doubt you'd like the performance.
I agree with you so I ordered another Cisco WAP321 off eBay for $50 with power supply. I can run all 3 in the single point setup. I plan for this third one to be in the window in the back so I can point it at the picnic table and setting area. They are all three going to be 5GHz only since there are too many other 2.4GHz networks around. I hope this works. Anybody have a better idea?
azazel1024
Very Senior Member
Do they have external antennas? If so you could run the antennas through the wall to the outside on pigtails. Or if you've got a bit of give on the window weather stripping, run them through the window and mount them outside. Just use short coax extensions.
My outdoor AP is a TP-Link WDR3600 (used to be an 841nd) with the antennas outside under the eves of my garage roof, on the end of 1 meter pigtails. Works great for outdoor coverage. I've got 100% of my rear yard (half an acre) covered with good to excellent 2.4GHz coverage and fair to excellent 5GHz coverage. Covers a small amount of my side yard too, but the aluminum siding kills the signal a lot once you get in to the side yard and the signal has to try to penetrate the wall of the garage to get there (fair 2.4GHz coverage only, even though maybe only 20-40ft from the antennas, 5GHz is crap there).
For giggles a couple of days ago I tried taking my laptop with me walking to the road in front of my backyard neighbor's house where I often take a talk. Its about 450ft from the antennas to that point. I could still get a 2.4GHz connection, though it was marginal (only about 8Mbps down and 3Mbps up, compared to around 70Mbps down and 45Mbps up on my laptop in my yard, ~100-120ft from the antennas). Had never tried before as my phone can only intermitently see my network at that distance and connecting fails. Another 3-5dB gain with some BIG omni's (there are 7dBi on there now) and I just might be able to get a slow wifi connection on my phone at that distance.
My outdoor AP is a TP-Link WDR3600 (used to be an 841nd) with the antennas outside under the eves of my garage roof, on the end of 1 meter pigtails. Works great for outdoor coverage. I've got 100% of my rear yard (half an acre) covered with good to excellent 2.4GHz coverage and fair to excellent 5GHz coverage. Covers a small amount of my side yard too, but the aluminum siding kills the signal a lot once you get in to the side yard and the signal has to try to penetrate the wall of the garage to get there (fair 2.4GHz coverage only, even though maybe only 20-40ft from the antennas, 5GHz is crap there).
For giggles a couple of days ago I tried taking my laptop with me walking to the road in front of my backyard neighbor's house where I often take a talk. Its about 450ft from the antennas to that point. I could still get a 2.4GHz connection, though it was marginal (only about 8Mbps down and 3Mbps up, compared to around 70Mbps down and 45Mbps up on my laptop in my yard, ~100-120ft from the antennas). Had never tried before as my phone can only intermitently see my network at that distance and connecting fails. Another 3-5dB gain with some BIG omni's (there are 7dBi on there now) and I just might be able to get a slow wifi connection on my phone at that distance.
azazel1024
Very Senior Member
One thing to note with outdoor coverage, 2.4GHz and 5GHz have roughly the same signal propagation in open air, so outdoor, 5GHz actually has pretty good coverage. HOWEVER, most routers have lower 5GHz radiated power than 2.4GHz. My WDR3600 at the same location line of sight, 5GHz is typically 6-7dB lower signal strength than 2.4GHz. My Archer C8 isn't quite as bad, but 5GHz is still typically 3-4dB lower than 2.4GHz, but this could be because of 5GHz beamforming on the router. Some of this is also perhaps attenuation from the signal penetrating the case of the devices I am using (phone, tablet, laptop) as well as the signal punching through the covering of the antennas (because, not bare metal). However, the rare of signal attenuation is the same (IE roughly 6dB per doubling of distance from client to base station antennas).
So outdoors you get a lot better coverage on 5GHz than you would indoors, but it still likely to be roughly 2/3 to half the range (because roughly 4-7dB lower signal). If you had bare metal antennas on both ends (or at least exposed antennas on the client, instead of inside of the chasis), the 2.4GHz and 5GHz range would most likely be pretty comparable.
In a window, even with internal antennas, on 5GHz, if the window is NOT low E coated, I'd expect you to be able to get a good connection out to at least 50ft and poor to fair maybe out to 100ft. If the window is low E coated, halve those distances.
So outdoors you get a lot better coverage on 5GHz than you would indoors, but it still likely to be roughly 2/3 to half the range (because roughly 4-7dB lower signal). If you had bare metal antennas on both ends (or at least exposed antennas on the client, instead of inside of the chasis), the 2.4GHz and 5GHz range would most likely be pretty comparable.
In a window, even with internal antennas, on 5GHz, if the window is NOT low E coated, I'd expect you to be able to get a good connection out to at least 50ft and poor to fair maybe out to 100ft. If the window is low E coated, halve those distances.
My 2.4GHz is crap now since the park put in all their wireless stuff. I can see the 10 foot pole and outdoor wireless device from my back yard. It is not a 100 hundred yards away from my back yard with no obstacle in the way.
I have noticed with the WAP321 I have about the same coverage with both 5GHz and 2.4 GHz. It could be my environment but to me they seem the same. It will be interesting to see what coverage I get outside from the window. The 5GHz does not seem to pass thru my brick outside wall very well. I guess it is lucky I have old windows in an old house.
I have noticed with the WAP321 I have about the same coverage with both 5GHz and 2.4 GHz. It could be my environment but to me they seem the same. It will be interesting to see what coverage I get outside from the window. The 5GHz does not seem to pass thru my brick outside wall very well. I guess it is lucky I have old windows in an old house.
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azazel1024
Very Senior Member
Your 2.4GHz and 5GHz coverage feeling the same is, my guess, an issue with the local noise floor of 2.4GHz.
If you've got a lot of 2.4GHz interference, and it sounds like you do, then the noise floor on 2.4GHz is going to be very high, meaning it doesn't take much wandering from your router/AP before you start getting big drops in speed. 5GHz on the other hand would likely have a very, very low noise floor, so even though the signal attenuates a lot faster than 2.4GHz through walls, the signal can drop to much lower levels and still maintain good performance.
If you've got a lot of 2.4GHz interference, and it sounds like you do, then the noise floor on 2.4GHz is going to be very high, meaning it doesn't take much wandering from your router/AP before you start getting big drops in speed. 5GHz on the other hand would likely have a very, very low noise floor, so even though the signal attenuates a lot faster than 2.4GHz through walls, the signal can drop to much lower levels and still maintain good performance.
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