Gripe: a terrible recommendation from this site

[brjoon1021]

I can't imagine how you still recommend or ever recommended the orbi for a home mesh Network. All you have to do is a little research and you'll find out how many problems buyers have had and how recalcitrant Netgear has been at dealing with their customers properly. I've had three months of complete frustration with the piece of garbage.
I've recently talked to two home/office network installers in the Southern California area and both of them told me they've had to remove every orbi they've put in a home or an office or a church building etc... due to complaints.
it seems that at some point you guys would have caught up with that information and added some caveats to your review or dropped the review especially since the 2.1 firmware is known to be a nightmare and has actually been pulled by Netgear. it's simply not a product worthy of anybody's money at this point

 

[e38BimmerFN]

Well depends if those business are using the Home version or Pro version which is tuned for more small business environments.

Not everyone has been having problems with the home version of Orbi. Also the new Beta FW has helped resolve many issues in the Orib that prior versions of FW had introduced.

There are other factors that can contribute to bad operation of any router. Those have to be vetted out first to see that the REAL problem is.

Mines been working great for me.

 

[RogerSC]

You can get lots of anecdotal input from people whose Orbi's are working fine (like me), but this web site is a testing web site for technical reviews and ranking of products. Someone who tests networking equipment isn't following and interpreting anecdotal user complaints for every device that they test. There's a matter of user/consumer responsibility...when I buy something, I don't look at just the sites that test and rank those products, I also look at the user forums for those products to see what the current complaints are. I would certainly do that if my business was installing networking equipment in my customer's businesses.

So I would advise those who install networking equipment either for their own use, or for a living, not just look at the test results here. Go look at the appropriate user forums, go look at the reviews on the marketplace sites, go look at whatever you can before you make your final selection of equipment for your customer. That's what I do *smile*.

 

[ppilot]

You can get lots of anecdotal input from people whose Orbi's are working fine (like me), but this web site is a testing web site for technical reviews and ranking of products. Someone who tests networking equipment isn't following and interpreting anecdotal user complaints for every device that they test. There's a matter of user/consumer responsibility...when I buy something, I don't look at just the sites that test and rank those products, I also look at the user forums for those products to see what the current complaints are. I would certainly do that if my business was installing networking equipment in my customer's businesses.

So I would advise those who install networking equipment either for their own use, or for a living, not just look at the test results here. Go look at the appropriate user forums, go look at the reviews on the marketplace sites, go look at whatever you can before you make your final selection of equipment for your customer. That's what I do *smile*.

I disagree to a point. The firmware rollouts for the Orbi have been absolute crapshoots even when following best practices for upgrading. I know in following discussions on this forum and on Netgear that there seemed to be fairly decent number of people who flat out gave up and moved onto other products (I would have been one of them but some of the biggest firmware messes didn't occur until after my return period expired). The ethernet backhaul issue pretty much typifies what I've seen and this easily has been the most frustrating technology experience I've dealt with considering the number of hours I've lost dealing with issues. I've had a nine month long open case with Netgear because they acknowledge the issues haven't found a way to fix them.

 

[e38BimmerFN]

Also could be cabling issues and environmental issues, ISP consideration that cause problems. Most people like to always blame problems on the router, however users have to fully troubleshoot and vet out what the real issue is. I agree there have been prior FW issues. I agree that most cases that routers and such should work out of the box, some do and some don't. However there are factors that can contribute to not seeing expected experiences out of the box.

However in most resent beta, users are finding better experiences in it. Just needs a good factory reset and set up from scratch.
https://community.netgear.com/t5/Or...-connection/m-p/1546809/highlight/true#M27629

There maybe other lingering issues as well, wifi interferences, bad cabling, mis-configurations and placement. All this, FW can't fix. Router and WIFi only work as well as the environments and configurations there set up in. This for for any router or wifi system.

 

[brjoon1021]

Thank you for all of the points made. Have any of you switched to the beta firmware and found that the dropping connectivity issues are gone? How about the terrible throughput of the satellite? I went through tech support for hours I did everything they said I placed them 45 to 50 feet apart - what they recommend. (Tech support told me that it is a known issue that if the orbi are closer together than 45 to 50 feet the satellite runs poorly and the satellite and router fight over the devices closer to the satellite and you can have bad throughput and connectivity issues... Didn't remember seeing that on the box!). For me, the throughput at the satellite is so bad I can't even stream YouTube or Netflix consistently with an "excellent" communication between router and satellite. I have a 100 megabyte download verified from my ISP with a new modem. Houses are few and far between where I live I'm not in an apartment... nearest house is 200 feet away. There's no problem with cabling so I'm really trying to determine whether to send this sucker back because I balked and kept it in my car after I read some of your reports... so I actually still have it. What I really want is for this damn thing to work! I don't want to pay the networking guy to come out here and set up the Ubiquiti unit and all the cabling and work in the wall and stuff he's going to charge me hundreds of dollars for.
- venting done... Have any of you switched to the new beta and had it improve the orbi ?
- on my latest call with tech support they tried to update me to an older firmware and tried to convince me that it was newer... they are terrible. And didn't tell me anything about the beta at all. I found about that on this forum or another forum.

 

[e38BimmerFN]

I'm running beta FW as well. Both wireless and wired backhaul on my satellite is stellar depending on which one I have set up. Currently wireless with satellite. I pay for 200/10 ISP services and just tested this yesterday and today both at router and satellite on a iPhone 6sP. Set at spec speeds. I stream DISH Joey data from mother in laws room via wireless bridge connected to the Satellite in next room. Have 3 wireless cameras connected to main router. Zero issues since I got the system installed. Beamforming is only enabled. All other wireless features are disabled for me since I don't have many MIMO devices.

Whats the Mfr and model if your ISP Modem? Mines Motorola MB7420 and stand alone. Any built in router? These can cause problems. Also what is your wireless environment like? Any neighbors? If so, how many? What channels are they using?

Im using manual channel 1 on 2.4Ghz and 48 on 5Ghz.

If you graduate to beta, please update the satellite first using a wired PC connection using IE11 or FF browsers. Then update the satellite. DO A FACTORY RESET then setup from scratch. I set up my router first and got it working and configured. Then added the Satellite later.

Router:
CPU Load: 20.72%
Memory Usage(Used/Total): 159 MB/484 MB
System Uptime: 3 days 07:37:08

Satellite:
CPU Load 16.9903%
Memory Usage(Used/Total) 177MB/484MB
Flash Usage(Used/Total) 32MB/4GB
Network Session(Active/Total) 4333/65536
System Uptime 04 days 04:40:21

 

[brjoon1021]

I'm running beta FW as well. Both wireless and wired backhaul on my satellite is stellar depending on which one I have set up. Currently wireless with satellite. I pay for 200/10 ISP services and just tested this yesterday and today both at router and satellite on a iPhone 6sP. Set at spec speeds. I stream DISH Joey data from mother in laws room via wireless bridge connected to the Satellite in next room. Have 3 wireless cameras connected to main router. Zero issues since I got the system installed. Beamforming is only enabled. All other wireless features are disabled for me since I don't have many MIMO devices.

Whats the Mfr and model if your ISP Modem? Mines Motorola MB7420 and stand alone. Any built in router? These can cause problems. Also what is your wireless environment like? Any neighbors? If so, how many? What channels are they using?

Im using manual channel 1 on 2.4Ghz and 48 on 5Ghz.

If you graduate to beta, please update the satellite first using a wired PC connection using IE11 or FF browsers. Then update the satellite. DO A FACTORY RESET then setup from scratch. I set up my router first and got it working and configured. Then added the Satellite later.

- With their tech support on the line, and the latest firmare (release) installed with fresh installation procedure we did the following about a month ago:

1.) NOT setting of the orbi with the phone app, but going through a website (using phone is fine, but the website)
2. about ethernet backhaul vs wifi backhaul, they have no recommendation. I am not using ethernet.
3.) Enable Implicit beamforming is recommended
4.) Enable MU-MIMO is recommended
5.) they said my router and satellite may be too close together at 25-30 feet. They recommend them to be 45-50 feet apart.
6). 2.4 GHz wireless channel to 6
7) 5 GHz wireless channel to 40

I am using the Cox cable modem that is DOCIS 3.0 that supports telephony. I don't know which one that is, but it must be here:
https://www.cox.com/residential/support/cox-certified-cable-modems.html

e38BimmerFN, I went to the thread that you said suggested a light at the end of the tunnel if I can paraphrase your reason for linking it. I don't know what you were reading there, but I read a LOT of people having a worse time and for longer than I have had. I am pretty sure I am finding a box for this POS now before I am stuck with it. Amazon it taking it back so I am stoked.

 

[e38BimmerFN]

1.) NOT setting of the orbi with the phone app, but going through a website (using phone is fine, but the website). Yes, Use a PC or laptop and a web browser, iIE11 or FF or Opera browsers is preferred.

2. about ethernet backhaul vs wifi backhaul, they have no recommendation. I am not using ethernet. Set up the Satellite via wireless first. Ethernet is LAN cable connected between the router and Satellite.

3.) Enable Implicit beamforming is recommended

4.) Enable MU-MIMO is recommended. You don't need this feature if you don't have any MIMO supporting devices. Even if you only have one, you don't need this feature. Disable Diasy Chaining and Fast Roaming as well.

5.) they said my router and satellite may be too close together at 25-30 feet. They recommend them to be 45-50 feet apart. Try using the Orbi router alone. The router can cover a large area by itself. Whats the size if your home? SqFt? Yes i have a 5000sq ft home and placement is about 40-45 feet in between router and satellite.

6). 2.4 GHz wireless channel to 6
7) 5 GHz wireless channel to 40'
These should be ok. Be sure there isn't a lot of other neighbors using them is all.

Look at your ISP Modem. There is a sticker and markings on the modem that will tell you the Mfr and model# of the modem.

 

[brjoon1021]

Thanks for your help everyone.
If I try the beta I will install as described for best practices and report back. I posted in the wireless buying advice section a question about the experiences users are having with the Ubiquiti setup. My networking acquaintance has it in his house and has put the AC pro router with AC pro APs in several clinics and homes (his own) and is encouraging me to go that route. I hope some people will chime in and let me know how they have liked that setup. He wants to put 2 AP at the wings of the house and the router in the middle using some cabling as I understand him

 

[e38BimmerFN]

Whats the size if your home? SqFt?

The reason for posting is to review the one user who just got his Orbi system running on Beta FW. If you read his earlier posts, he was using timers on all his equipment which should not be needed on any router or these Orbi systems. His recent post is his experience after doing a factory reset on his router and taking out the timers.

Theres others in the entire thread that have posted problems being solved using the bata and doing full factory resets on there systems then setup from scratch. Ya theres some bad experiences, however don't fail to see the positive ones as well. Theres other posts in the NG Orbi forum that have good experiences. Not all are bad.

 

[brjoon1021]

Whats the size if your home? SqFt?

The reason for posting is to review the one user who just got his Orbi system running on Beta FW. If you read his earlier posts, he was using timers on all his equipment which should not be needed on any router or these Orbi systems. His recent post is his experience after doing a factory reset on his router and taking out the timers.

Theres others in the entire thread that have posted problems being solved using the bata and doing full factory resets on there systems then setup from scratch. Ya theres some bad experiences, however don't fail to see the positive ones as well. Theres other posts in the NG Orbi forum that have good experiences. Not all are bad.

 

[brjoon1021]

2600 square feet shaped like a bracket " [ " with bedrooms on each end that extend out from the main body or hallway of the house.

 

[e38BimmerFN]

Where is the router placed and satellite?

2600sq ft is kind of small for an Orbi system. Maybe a entry level model. A single router place centrally, even the orbi router placed centrally should cover your entire home.
What is the model# of your Orbi system?

I have a 5000sq ft house, Orbi router place at one end and 1 satellite placed 40 feet away a the opposite end. Two story. Router on upper 2nd level and satellite on main floor at other end. I have stellar coverage, range and performance with a 40 series system.

I would try the Orbi router alone if you can get it centrally placed. If it's at one end, then maybe placement of the satellite at the opposite end should work, depending on the distance in between. 25-30 is too close. This falls in the wires coverage of the Orbi router.

 

[System Error Message]

I can't imagine how you still recommend or ever recommended the orbi for a home mesh Network. All you have to do is a little research and you'll find out how many problems buyers have had and how recalcitrant Netgear has been at dealing with their customers properly. I've had three months of complete frustration with the piece of garbage.
I've recently talked to two home/office network installers in the Southern California area and both of them told me they've had to remove every orbi they've put in a home or an office or a church building etc... due to complaints.
it seems that at some point you guys would have caught up with that information and added some caveats to your review or dropped the review especially since the 2.1 firmware is known to be a nightmare and has actually been pulled by Netgear. it's simply not a product worthy of anybody's money at this point

Regrettably i was not there to recommend something for you as i usually recommend something along the lines of configurable to a business. I have not yet received any complaint about a recommendation of mine going bad after followed.

I dont see the netgear orbi a business grade product actually, more of for homes. In the past for non consumer setups, WDS was used which allowed quite a lot of flexibility as we have for meshes nowadays, granted its not the highest performing thing but as long as the wireless range was good between APs and that sufficient APs were connected to ethernet, the experience was quite decent for what limited WAN speeds we had a decade ago. We also would set up dedicated wifi to wifi bridges rather than dual purposing APs.

Make sure that the signal between each AP and another is good. I also would fault netgear quality, it seems to have been dropping both hardware and firmware (we knew firmware wasnt great but netgear is becoming like dlink). Sad to say even i myself have issues with netgear modems both hardware and firmware.

 

[RogerSC]

Don't know much about D-Link, but I can't fault Netgear hardware. I find their hardware some of the best and most reliable, especially compared to the others. At least that's how it's been for me. Firmware can be spotty, but the hardware has been solid for me. Maybe it depends on what specific Netgear models you're looking at? I've had the R7000, R7800, and Orbi (plus some miscellaneous unmanaged switches. etc.), and have found the hardware to be great. Also just got a Netgear CM500V modem which is proving to be another solid piece of hardware, and no problems with the firmware on the CM500V yet.

 

[System Error Message]

Don't know much about D-Link, but I can't fault Netgear hardware. I find their hardware some of the best and most reliable, especially compared to the others. At least that's how it's been for me. Firmware can be spotty, but the hardware has been solid for me. Maybe it depends on what specific Netgear models you're looking at? I've had the R7000, R7800, and Orbi (plus some miscellaneous unmanaged switches. etc.), and have found the hardware to be great. Also just got a Netgear CM500V modem which is proving to be another solid piece of hardware, and no problems with the firmware on the CM500V yet.

In the past yes, even i had some of netgear older hardware, the problem is now that a lot of their manufacturing is in china under foxxcon which isnt really known for its quality manufacturing among many brands that use them. For instance, many repair shops tell me their main customers bring foxxconn boards.

We already know firmware quality from netgear sucks but at least hardware was good. This isnt the case anymore as even their modems in bridge mode hang.

 

[e38BimmerFN]

Ive only had few issues with D-Link HW. Ya there new UI is more simplified for the home user and not as granular for advanced users. There HW is pretty good. Only found a few HW flaws in there older routers. Not using metal heat sinks when they had these bad composite ones. D-Links HW has been good over the years. Really no complaints. There version of NG Orbi is pretty good.

Most of DLink routers are supporting of 3rd party FW. So for advanced users, this is a good solution for them.