How to increase 5GHz wireless range for RT-AC68U

[dlandiss]

11n and 11ac do offer additional EC capabilities and gains thru MIMO that cut thru the noise to some extent...

Here is an interesting chart that depicts the Bit Error Rate of various modulation schemes as a function of S/N.

 

[L&LD]

No references usually means that nobody has been able to duplicate your observations. It is risky to anthropomorphize an integrated circuit or communications protocol.

I am not aware of any scenario in 802.11 fitting "What higher transmitting power offers is the chance for the client to lock onto the signal and for the router to then listen for that client going forward."

As far as I understand it router broadcasts its SSID about 10 times a second. If a client wants to log in, it must respond with a password and its protocol capabilities. The router must then respond to the client that it is logged in and a two-way connection exists.

If that initial handshake does not occur, there is no connection. If the S/N ratio of the client side of that handshake, as received by the router, is too low; the handshake never completes.

Listen to sfx2000 -- he understands the server/client relationship and handshaking better than I do.

No, somebody else did agree with me (or I with them), but I mistakenly thought it was sfx2000.

Like I said, the theory is great, real life is something else and my examples showed the difference as clearly as possible.

I'll continue to offer my knowledge / implementations to my customers. They do not argue with the results.

 

[dlandiss]

I'll continue to offer my knowledge / implementations to my customers. They do not argue with the results.

Nor do mine, and we all run 80mW transmitter power.

 

[Calisro]

This is always a highly debated topic. Same debates on tomato, dd-wrt, merlin, stock, yada, yada. My suggestion is to test it yourself and decide within the constraints of your local law. I personally had trouble using some devices in a corner of my house and I couldn't move the AP which would have been a better approach. I increased my power some, and my devices are now perfectly functional. I agree with the 'theory' but I also agree with my own real world tests which can be different for many reasons.

 

[L&LD]

Nor do mine, and we all run 80mW transmitter power.

http://www.snbforums.com/threads/asuswrt-merlin-378-55-3_hgg-final-mod.26524/page-2#post-199549

This is an example of how higher power helped.

I'm pretty sure that thread offers more examples too.

 

[RogerSC]

One thing that I haven't seen mentioned is to play with router and antenna orientation. I've found here that the orientation of the routers that I use is critical to getting good signals in the furthest areas of my house. I can rotate my router and watch the signal go up and then down again as I move the router through the optimal orientation at those farthest points. And the changes in orientation to see this are not large, so there's definitely lobes on the signal coverage *smile*. Fortunately, due to the shape of my house and where the router is, the optimal position of my router for the farthest point also provides good full coverage here.

Anyways, my point is that once you have your router high enough relative to the floor, then rotating it and watching the signal in the weakest areas can really help.

 

[AndreaS]

Don't forget MIMO. If a client is compatible (many portable devices are not), and, due to the increased power of the router is able to detect the connection, then the router is able to adjust the beam to improve the connection.
Personally I changed my AC68 bootloader with the 1.0.21 USA one, that, don't ask me why, as a side effect increased by 2db the S/N in the same conditions, and gave me the ability to get up to 512 MW TX power (I don't want to stress too much the transmitter to avoid signal distortion) and added three 9dbi antennas. Now my router, located in the basement easily covers the upper floor with the 5GHz band with all the mobile devices (3 tablets and four smartphones, all from Samsung).

 

[kvic]

Calisro, your anedoctal evidence carries little weight if you can't come up with a reasonable explanation.

While adjusting tx power is a debatable topic, the subsequent discussion in the thread is actually not so. Truth clear is on the side of science. Two gents here provided valuable information which is verifiable and repeatable. That some ppl consider carrying huge weight. Maybe it's just me. Personally I find it a bit irritating when people speak louder than truth from anedoctal experience.

I'm one of those who are grateful to science that isn't based on democracy. Btw, who here is aware of the difference between theory vs theorem? No need to raise your hand..lol

 

[sfx2000]

No, somebody else did agree with me (or I with them), but I mistakenly thought it was sfx2000.

Like I said, the theory is great, real life is something else and my examples showed the difference as clearly as possible.

I'll continue to offer my knowledge / implementations to my customers. They do not argue with the results.

All g00d - again the best solution is move the AP to where the clients are...

If it's not possible from the intial ingress point - turn off WiFi on it, just use it as a router, and put an AP/(Router/AP in AP mode) to a location where it works best.

 

[joegreat]

One thing that I haven't seen mentioned is to play with router and antenna orientation. I've found here that the orientation of the routers that I use is critical to getting good signals in the furthest areas of my house. I can rotate my router and watch the signal go up and then down again as I move the router through the optimal orientation at those farthest points. And the changes in orientation to see this are not large, so there's definitely lobes on the signal coverage *smile*. Fortunately, due to the shape of my house and where the router is, the optimal position of my router for the farthest point also provides good full coverage here.

Hi,

The original antennas are omnidirectional and distribute the signal equally in all directions. Of course some routers use beamforming to direct signals to the clients, but this does not change the characteristics of the antennas.

To improve the signal into one direction you need to use a directional antenna like this one: Asus WL-ANT157 or Delock RP-SMA. By replacing the middle one of the three antennas you change the signal direction from omni to the flat front and back of the antenna. On top the reception of the device/client signals improves due to the higher reception gain: 5 dBi @ 2.5 GHz and 7 dBi @ 5.7 GHz (compared to the 2 dBi of the original antennas this is a lot)!

In my case this trick changed the coverage a lot, and the devices are now also much better received by the routers!

With kind regards
Joe

 

[bilboSNB]

Which of these would be best for an ac68u , mine is also at one side of the house and I cant get it to the centre easily

http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B00R1PA9EO/?tag=smallncom-21
http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B003ZWILOW/?tag=smallncom-21
http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B000N9B66U/?tag=smallncom-21

 

[AndreaS]

Hi,

To improve the signal into one direction you need to use a directional antenna like this one: Asus WL-ANT157 or Delock RP-SMA.

With kind regards
Joe

But feeding signal with an opportune phase shift to an array can obtain the same result, that's how beamforming works. In practice theory is only partially applicable in normal environments as it's assumptions and results heavily depend on the environment that normally is free field.
I our houses there are too many variables to consider to be able to predict the result (walls and their composition, metallic obstacles, electric wires that can act as passive antennas, external interferences and so on) that produce so many reflections, absorptions and signal transmissions that it is not worth to even try a purely theoretical approach due to its complexity.
That's why the best solution is to try and see.

 

[joegreat]

Which of these would be best for an ac68u , mine is also at one side of the house and I cant get it to the centre easily

Hi,

Some suggestions/hints:
1. Avoid any(!) cables between your router and the antenna - with the cable you can easily loose more then you win with the updated antenna!
2. Keep in mind the the high gain antenna will also narrow the signal - I would not suggest to go above 5-7 dBi unless you have a long distance to cover (e.g. point to point connection to another high gain antenna).
3. Always look for an antenna for 2.4 and 5 GHz band - not only for one!

With kind regards
Joe

 

[RogerSC]

Hi,

The original antennas are omnidirectional and distribute the signal equally in all directions. Of course some routers use beamforming to direct signals to the clients, but this does not change the characteristics of the antennas.

To improve the signal into one direction you need to use a directional antenna like this one: Asus WL-ANT157 or Delock RP-SMA. By replacing the middle one of the three antennas you change the signal direction from omni to the flat front and back of the antenna. On top the reception of the device/client signals improves due to the higher reception gain: 5 dBi @ 2.5 GHz and 7 dBi @ 5.7 GHz (compared to the 2 dBi of the original antennas this is a lot)!

In my case this trick changed the coverage a lot, and the devices are now also much better received by the routers!

With kind regards
Joe

Hey thanks, but...at my house, the radiation pattern from the router has not proved to be a perfect sphere, despite the fact that it is nominally omnidirectional. When I rotate the router, the signal strength varies at the farthest points from my router. I haven't graphed it, but I'm positive that this is the case for every router that I've ever had, since the router orientation has mattered for each one.

It has been well worth my while to play around to verify this. The "neatest" orientation (front panel parallel to the wall *smile*) isn't the strongest orientation for the farthest spots in my house. I would have poor coverage in those spots if I hadn't played with the orientation of my routers.

Just try it, you may be surprised. Or maybe not, maybe it's just the electromagnetic properties of my house and orientation doesn't matter anywhere else *smile*, could be.

I definitiely don't want a more directional antenna, since I can accomplish what I need here without it, and more directionality would cause problems in other areas.

 

[AndreaS]

Hey thanks, but...at my house, the radiation pattern from the router has not proved to be a perfect sphere, despite the fact that it is nominally omnidirectional. When I rotate the router, the signal strength varies at the farthest points from my router. I haven't graphed it, but I'm positive that this is the case for every router that I've ever had, since the router orientation has mattered for each one.

It has been well worth my while to play around to verify this. The "neatest" orientation (front panel parallel to the wall *smile*) isn't the strongest orientation for the farthest spots in my house. I would have poor coverage in those spots if I hadn't played with the orientation of my routers.

Just try it, you may be surprised. Or maybe not, maybe it's just the electromagnetic properties of my house and orientation doesn't matter anywhere else *smile*, could be.

I definitiely don't want a more directional antenna, since I can accomplish what I need here without it, and more directionality would cause problems in other areas.

Any antenna with a gain greater than 0db (asus ones are 2 dbi) is not omnidirectional. In addition to that you are not playing with an antenna but with an array of them, so the radiation diagram is anything but omnidirectional.

 

[RogerSC]

Any antenna with a gain greater than 0db (asus ones are 2 dbi) is not omnidirectional. In addition to that you are not playing with an antenna but with an array of them, so the radiation diagram is anything but omnidirectional.

Good points, once you have an antenna with gain, it can't be omnidirectional anymore. Although the change in the signal pattern can be in a vertical direction, we have a two story house so I don't want to flatten the radiation pattern, either *smile*.

 

[Cake]

Hi,

Some suggestions/hints:
1. Avoid any(!) cables between your router and the antenna - with the cable you can easily loose more then you win with the updated antenna!
2. Keep in mind the the high gain antenna will also narrow the signal - I would not suggest to go above 5-7 dBi unless you have a long distance to cover (e.g. point to point connection to another high gain antenna).
3. Always look for an antenna for 2.4 and 5 GHz band - not only for one!

With kind regards
Joe

I confirm this too. Last year I spent a day putting 3x 10M lengths of coax cable through the roof and plugged in some long 2.4Ghz antenna's in under the rain gutters. (I shut off the 5ghz on the router)
The result was terrible! Spent another day removing my experiment. AC68U

 

[AndreaS]

Good points, once you have an antenna with gain, it can't be omnidirectional anymore. Although the change in the signal pattern can be in a vertical direction, we have a two story house so I don't want to flatten the radiation pattern, either *smile*.

You're right, but here comes the antenna orientation. I use three 9dbi stylus antennas with the two external ones put in horizontal position and the central one put vertical. With this configuration at 2.4 GHz and 500 MW transmit power I am able to cover from the basement two overlying floors, and in very dry days even a third one.
But, I repeat, this is my case, not sure it will work for other people.

 

[bilboSNB]

Finally got a laptop with ac, where I was struggling on 5g with my tablet is great on the new laptop, 25MB/s transfer of a large file from wired server.

35MB/s at about 10 feet, is this in line with others experiences?

 

[dlandiss]

Finally got a laptop with ac, where I was struggling on 5g with my tablet is great on the new laptop, 25MB/s transfer of a large file from wired server.

35MB/s at about 10 feet, is this in line with others experiences?

At 10 feet my limit is the 135Mbps max of my ISP, observed on both a laptop and a mobile phone. It could be more, I have not tested with local files.