Ditching the AC87.. now what ? 5300 / 3200 /88 ?

[SoCalReviews]

I'm not sure if placebo effect is the right term - more along the lines of confirmation bias - where spending more must be better, because of the bigger numbers on the box, and people tend to want to believe they made the right choice, however the numbers fall - people don't want to be wrong, or considered by others that they made an incorrect choice.

I agree. I pointed out to the OP that "placebo" wasn't a good term to use but explained that there could be some real science relating to quantum effects and the intention of the observer... I know... difficult to show measurable effects... but yes... "Confirmation bias" is a much better description of psychological effects the OP was referring to.

 

[SoCalReviews]

Although I understand your thought process, I would challenge this conclusion. I have had nearly flawless wireless performance for 1.5 years. Then one day it became very finicky. Random drops, reduced distance, pages failing to load etc. The cause? One three ring binder had been placed on the desk within 6 inches of where the router sat. I moved the binder and the issues all went away. There isnt a lot of metal in a three ring binder, but man it made a difference in wireless performance.

There is plenty of metal (copper tracings carrying current and electric fields) inside the router which is not only near the antennas but right next to the antenna tracings on the board. My Macbook Pro body is made of mostly aluminum as well as iPads, iPhones, metal cased laptops and many other hand held wireless devices. All those devices don't even use external antennas but they are surrounded by metals or aluminum metal... and all my devices work great. It's very common for users to install routers on top of metal quipment and near metal desks, metal objects etc. . We know that this can be a potential issue that can effect obstruction of the radio signal but if this was such a big deal that dramatically impacted everyone's wireless performance I think that that tens of millions of users would know by now.

 

[sfx2000]

Maybe there really was an improvement until you measured it... removed the uncertainty and collapsed the quantum probability wave function.

It's a very real thing though - I recall we had a problematic product (early on, we fixed the issues), and we did a followon that was exactly the same board and software, just in a different housing - and the feedback was that new new product was better in every way possible - even though it was exactly the same, just a different housing..

 

[SoCalReviews]

It's a very real thing though - I recall we had a problematic product (early on, we fixed the issues), and we did a followon that was exactly the same board and software, just in a different housing - and the feedback was that new new product was better in every way possible - even though it was exactly the same, just a different housing..

I understand. I get it. There could have been a lot of reasons why the different housing improved the product besides the fact that the housing was metal. It's possible that that particular design had problems with that particular metal housing. It might have worked fine with another board design or different shaped metal housing. Look at the example of the iPhone 4 where the antenna design negatively impacted the wireless phone signal. How the person held the phone dramatically effected performance. The exact same phone put in a plastic case also could impacted performance or eliminate the problem. It's not just the fact that the router antennas are near metal. Remember that even the human body is full of water and iron based fluid, etc.. There are many environmental factors involved.

 

[anon2015]

There is plenty of metal (copper tracings carrying current and electric fields) inside the router which is not only near the antennas but right next to the antenna tracings on the board. My Macbook Pro body is made of mostly aluminum as well as iPads, iPhones, metal cased laptops and many other hand held wireless devices. All those devices don't even use external antennas but they are surrounded by metals or aluminum metal... and all my devices work great.

Mobile devices, and all wireless devices to some degree, are designed to work with the metal they contain. The antennae are optimized for the application including their metal body when applicable and are susceptible to unforeseen interference. Antennagate was overblown, but is a perfect example of the possible problems that can arise from minor changes from the intended use. Im not claiming metal will destroy performance, but it can make a big difference. Every setup is different and not everyone will have a problem when wireless devices are near metal, but I have been amazed at the effects on my network.

Your mileage may vary.

 

[anon2015]

Look at the example of the iPhone 4

Sorry, had to laugh when we cited the same example. I didnt see this until after I posted.

 

[SoCalReviews]

Sorry, had to laugh when we cited the same example. I didnt see this until after I posted.

Nice... You're psychic... lol!

 

[sfx2000]

I understand. I get it. There could have been a lot of reasons why the different housing improved the product besides the fact that the housing was metal.

We changed the color of the housing (from blue on grey, to grey on green) and changed the LED backlight colors from blue to green - everything else was exactly the same - but A/B testing, 80 percent of the testers swore up and down that the RevB product was better... (doesn't help that RevA 1.0 was a particularly troubled child, we pushed the edge on that product, and RevB was a marketing spin only)

confirmation bias... go figure

 

[SoCalReviews]

We changed the color of the housing (from blue on grey, to grey on green) and changed the LED backlight colors from blue to green - everything else was exactly the same - but A/B testing, 80 percent of the testers swore up and down that the RevB product was better... (doesn't help that RevA 1.0 was a particularly troubled child, we pushed the edge on that product, and RevB was a marketing spin only)

confirmation bias... go figure

Haha! Too funny!

What's you're favorite color? Blue... No Green. Shhh... no revealing industry secrets.

 

[SoCalReviews]

Back in the day I used to work in a high end stereo store... We had high end speaker cables that were marketed to stereo enthusiasts who demanded the best equipment and were willing to pay whatever it took for the best sound. We sold very good sounding, high quality copper speaker cables. The owner and I would A/B test all the cables. Then one day the owner hooked up several cents per foot of common 12 gauge solid copper house wire with the two wires wrapped in a twist configuration around each other (to help cancel out the field effect and outside RF interference) all the way to the speakers.

Without telling customers he used it for A/B comparison tests of several cents per foot of solid copper house wire vs. four dollar per foot "high end" speaker cable. Almost all of the high end customers chose the common copper house wire as the best sounding speaker cable... and in fact it was the best sounding to our ears too. The problem is that it's hard to market pennies per foot house electrical wire as speaker cable... We kept this secret to ourselves since it couldn't be marketed to the high end customers... For many of these customers spending all that money was just as important as the real world experience of listening.

...Yes, marketing matters.

 

[sfx2000]

Haha! Too funny!

What's you're favorite color? Blue... No Green. Shhh... no revealing industry secrets.

Fun story - we had a RevC of the same product, except it had twice the flash and twice the RAM, to support a real WAP browser and Java (the RevA/B was Brew and Openwave's fempto protoWAP) - and it was a pig - I did an engineering build to nuke the browser/java, increased the efs size to support 500 contacts and 2000 sms messages - and I was everyone's best friend in engineering

 

[sfx2000]

Then one day the owner hooked up several cents per foot of common 12 gauge solid copper house wire with the two wires wrapped in a twist configuration around each other (to help cancel out the field effect and outside RF interference) all the way to the speakers.

Sounds like Monster (tm) Cable, lol... but the audiophile industry on the the high end is pretty weird - $1,000 power cables with ion-aligned virgin copper makes a better sound over digital - yeah, right...

 

[SoCalReviews]

Sounds like Monster (tm) Cable, lol... but the audiophile industry on the the high end is pretty weird - $1,000 power cables with ion-aligned virgin copper makes a better sound over digital - yeah, right...

Ya... there was Monster Cable ::cough:: ::cough:: and there were the "others" that went into a higher level of esoteric quality for a premium price... of course...the ion-aligned virgin copper was the key... from special secret copper mines in the Australian outback...that until recently only the Aboriginal natives knew about... It improved the speaker cable sound quality a gazillion percent...

Actually maybe those virgin copper mines were located in New Zealand near the mountains where they later filmed Lord of the Rings... It all sounds good. Lol! Those were the days. Now people are happy with a good iTunes download.