Help with building wired/wireless network

[riotburn]

Hi, I'm looking to replace my current setup with some more modern hardware and hopefully fix some deficiencies and have more configuration options. I live in a 2 floor brick house (wood floors/beams) + concrete basement, about 750 sqtft/floor. Modem is in basement connected to main router. The main router is connected to an switch which connects to 2 google wifi pucks, workstation, and another switch that has tv/ps4/home server. I think I've settled on asus routers. I'm getting bogged down in all the possible options. I think I would like to have 6E routers just to future proof. But should i just get a wifi6 for the basement (least used area) and then a 6E for the first and second floor? Which routers should I get? Would 2 routers suffice if the first floor one has better range? Should the main router have a lot of ports and I can just get rid of the switch? Any advice would be much appreciated

 

[OzarkEdge]

Hi, I'm looking to replace my current setup with some more modern hardware and hopefully fix some deficiencies and have more configuration options. I live in a 2 floor brick house (wood floors/beams) + concrete basement, about 750 sqtft/floor. Modem is in basement connected to main router. The main router is connected to an switch which connects to 2 google wifi pucks, workstation, and another switch that has tv/ps4/home server. I think I've settled on asus routers. I'm getting bogged down in all the possible options. I think I would like to have 6E routers just to future proof. But should i just get a wifi6 for the basement (least used area) and then a 6E for the first and second floor? Which routers should I get? Would 2 routers suffice if the first floor one has better range? Should the main router have a lot of ports and I can just get rid of the switch? Any advice would be much appreciated

I would start with one router on the middle floor, assuming you can extend the basement coax/modem/Ethernet to it... the RT-AX86U Pro, if you can afford it. Keep using your switches... more convenient than wiring everything to the back of the router. Don't add more WiFi unless you need it... a 750sf footprint is a relatively small area to cover.

Is the house wired for coax (RG-?) or Ethernet (CAT?). If you do add another router/AP/node, how can you connect it back to the main router... wired or wireless (wired is more robust/less troublesome... wireless deserves to be dedicated WiFi, a third band... to prepare for this requires more discovery)? Perhaps a packaged mesh system would be better for you... depends on the make and you probably would want it to be better than what you're retiring.

Buy for your current needs... future proofing is not too practical with networking... I have two WiFi6/ax clients... second one arrived yesterday... not even thinking about WiFi6e, and WiFi7 is arriving (but will take awhile).

My install notes may offer some cryptic clues for now and for later.

OE

 

[riotburn]

@OzarkEdge thanks for your response. The house is wired with ethernet and not adding anymore than what exists. So I guess I could technically add one router to the first floor but then not sure how I would connect that back to all the wired connections which terminate back in the basement without running another cable. The first and second floor already have Google Wifi pucks wired to the main puck in the basement.

 

[Piotrek]

Modem is in basement connected to main router. The main router is connected to an switch which connects to 2 google wifi pucks,

Why do you want to change what you have?
How many devices do you have, what type and how do they connect (Ethernet, WiFi 2,4GHz, Wi-Fi 5GHz)?

 

[OzarkEdge]

@OzarkEdge thanks for your response. The house is wired with ethernet and not adding anymore than what exists. So I guess I could technically add one router to the first floor but then not sure how I would connect that back to all the wired connections which terminate back in the basement without running another cable. The first and second floor already have Google Wifi pucks wired to the main puck in the basement.

Given existing Ethernet to support wired backhauls, your new equipment does not require a third band for dedicated wireless backhauls, so you can avoid tri-band routers that dice up the 5.0 band (5-1, 5-2)... a WiFi6e or tri-band purchase would be just to add the 6.0 band for client use... not terribly necessary (but 6.0's 160MHz bandwidth without DFS disruption would be nice, if you have any WiFi6e clients)... your choice/expense.

If one router at first will do it, you would plan to locate it centrally on the middle floor, if possible. If two routers are determined necessary, you would then want to spread them far and wide... 750sf is not wide enough imo, so perhaps 2nd floor and basement, diagonally. You would want to plan for these variations.

As for the routing of existing Ethernet... they alway seem to forget the second cable where you need it. Consider your options/workarounds. One is to put a router (no AP) in the basement and AP(s) at the other end of the cable(s).

If you had the ASUS router, you could trial its coverage to answer the question, 'is one enough'. I've used the AC86U, AX86U, and now the AX86U Pro to cover my three levels... router on the middle/ground level at the end farthest from a detached garage where my AiMesh node is... 77' but through interior drywalls/kitchen and two exterior brick walls... this stretched the wireless backhaul when I had it, but roaming is good... you want clients to have a clear choice of the better signal, not two strong signals everywhere.

If using more APs, then using less transmit power may be in order... maybe your existing Google APs are not too powerful. Have they presented any particular WiFi issues in your space?

OE

 

[Tech9]

I think I've settled on asus routers.

There are quite a few forum members running access points from Cisco, Ubiquiti, TP-Link, Zyxel with x86 firewalls running pfSense/OPNsense. There are better options out there than home routers used as access points. Look around, there are many examples. Better than home "mesh" systems.

I think I would like to have 6E routers just to future proof.

With Wi-Fi 7 routers available by the end of the year there is no much future proofing with unpopular now Wi-Fi 6E. There is very limited selection of clients now and perhaps new ones are not coming at all. The market will skip Wi-Fi 6E and focus on Wi-Fi 7 even for purely marketing reasons.

 

[riotburn]

As for the routing of existing Ethernet... they alway seem to forget the second cable where you need it. Consider your options/workarounds. One is to put a router (no AP) in the basement and AP(s) at the other end of the cable(s).

@OzarkEdge What router (no AP) and AP would you recommend?

There are quite a few forum members running access points from Cisco, Ubiquiti, TP-Link, Zyxel with x86 firewalls running pfSense/OPNsense. There are better options out there than home routers used as access points. Look around, there are many examples. Better than home "mesh" systems.

i had briefly looked at the Cisco ones. I have pfSense on my home server but not sure if I'd want to go so far as to self manage the firewall.

 

[OzarkEdge]

@OzarkEdge What router (no AP) and AP would you recommend?

Someone else here with relevant experience may have some suggestions. I've gotten by with wireless routers like most home users.

OE

 

[Tech9]

I have pfSense on my home server

Not sure what pfSense is doing on a home server. If you need user friendly solution you are limited to similar to Raspberry Pi hardware in home routers and whatever they offer as "mesh" with associated limitations. With Asus AiMesh you have very limited control. No different channels, no different SSIDs, no individual power control. If your routers are not in right places roaming will be challenge. Your current Google Wi-Fi setup may be better "mesh" than AiMesh. We have folks here using Asus router as router only and Nest Wi-Fi Pro or eero Pro for Wi-Fi for good reasons.

 

[riotburn]

Thoughts on getting the https://www.amazon.com/dp/B08BJJ3RGW/?tag=snbforums-20 as a router and 2 of these https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0BTTZ7CTL/?tag=snbforums-20 as access points?

Not sure what pfSense is doing on a home server.

overkill vlan and some other stuff playing around with proxmox.

 

[Tech9]

With Ethernet available the last thing I would be looking at is a home router with accent on RGB lights and 2x repeaters as access points. If user friendly is the main goal I would rather go GL.iNet GL-MT2500 as gateway, some TP-Link TL-SG1005P switch and PoE OC200 controller with the new mini PoE EAP6xx access points. The gateway runs OpenWrt firmware, VPN options galore, built-in AdGuard Home and Omada is one of the best budget SMB systems. You don't even need the hardware controller. Omada SDN is a free software for Windows/Linux. It may come even cheaper than your router with repeaters.

 

[riotburn]

With Ethernet available the last thing I would be looking at is a home router with accent on RGB lights and 2x repeaters as access points.

hah, on the occasion I go to the utility room where the router would be, I want to be greeted by the warm blue light.

If user friendly is the main goal I would rather go GL.iNet GL-MT2500 as gateway, some TP-Link TL-SG1005P switch and PoE OC200 controller with the new mini PoE EAP6xx access points. The gateway runs OpenWrt firmware, VPN options galore, built-in AdGuard Home and Omada is one of the best budget SMB systems. You don't even need the hardware controller. Omada SDN is a free software for Windows/Linux. It may come even cheaper than your router with repeaters.

The GL.iNet looks like a nice option. I saw Omada system but didn't like the having to make an account to use it. Though google is already reading all my data...

 

[Tech9]

I saw Omada system but didn't like the having to make an account to use it.

As I remember it's only needed if you want remote management via Omada controller. You can use VPN server though to access your network. Account is good when you manage multiple networks from one screen. You can also run the wired APs without controller, but it limits the possible options, may hurt the roaming and you can't have wireless mesh APs. The main idea - it's way more flexible and expandable system than AiMesh.

Also note - Asus routers send data to TrendMicro for AiProtection, Adaptive QoS, Traffic Analyzer, App Analyzer, App based Parental Controls, and even Web History. All the options listed run data collection daemon on background and the router contacts TrendMicro servers multiple times a day.

 

[Tech Junky]

market will skip Wi-Fi 6E

I've been back and forth on the idea since 6E was announced and didn't take the bait as it's just AX with 6ghz w/ no benefit of increased speed. BE/7 is at least offering something worth salivating over with 320mhz bandwidth which should yield ~3gbps compared to 160mhz @ 1.5gbps. Of course the average user won't need the bandwidth provided unless they're doing data dumps on the LAN or have a fat 5GE / 10GE pipe,

@riotburn

There's a million ways to skin the cat here but, a Router is supposed to only be connected to the ISP not daisy chained together like Asus likes to sell them as a mesh., It's a waste of money. Get a single router preferably w/o wireless and a couple of AP's. When WIFI updates come along you just need to swap the AP's and keep on bit surfing. You can get a AX-E AP for $150/ea and a wired only router for ~$100 or less. $400 for a complete setup sounds better than $500 for a single Asus router that will be obsolete in 6 months.

 

[riotburn]

@Tech9 hmmm, since I have the home server, I could even save a little and run the software controller from there. Also I have an 8 port switch (not PoE) but all the ethernet runs are right next to outlets.

@Tech Junky more Im reading on the omada, seems like the way to go. Any router you recommend?

 

[riotburn]

Any thoughts on this router? https://www.amazon.com/dp/B08QTXNWZ1/?tag=snbforums-20

 

[Tech9]

ER605 is the cheapest SafeStream router available. Some features are available with Omada Controller only. They are listed in specifications.

ER605 GUI emulator:

Opening...

emulator.tp-link.com

Omada SDN Controller emulator:

Omada Controller

emulator.tp-link.com

 

[Tech Junky]

@Tech Junky more Im reading on the omada, seems like the way to go. Any router you recommend?

I gave up on consumer gear and built my own instead using a PC and Linux.

If I were buying something premade it would be a non wireless router and an AP for WiFi.

I originally built my setup with am internal AC card and used it as an AP.

 

[riotburn]

I wound up going with the brume2, 2 tp-link WAP, and Omada controller running in a vm. Thanks for the advice.

Also found the issue with the second floor wifi:

 

[drinkingbird]

I wound up going with the brume2, 2 tp-link WAP, and Omada controller running in a vm. Thanks for the advice.

Also found the issue with the second floor wifi:

There's an IT Humor facebook group that shows botched installs - that's right out of their playbook.

Hey, at low speeds it might work, but I'd at least use butt splice connectors or wire nuts.

In reality, cut them both and terminate them with keystone jacks (female RJ45) and use a patch cable. Or if you can crimp, crimp RJ45 ends on and use a good coupler, or put a keystone on one and rj45 on the other.

A small piece of 110 block and a punchdown will be good for up to gig speed too, maybe 2.5.