TP-LINK powerline vs Netgear router: network coverage disappointment

[SpaceTofu]

Hi all,

I am aware that this post will be judged as perhaps trivial or quite unfounded.
I hope some will stick with me. Let me make clear from the beginning that I am not a net enthusiast, but for pretty much everything in life, I like to have the best that my budget allows and thus I like to research and understand matters.

I bought a couple of years back a TP-LINK TL-WPA8630P KIT AV1200 Gigabit Powerline Dual Band AC1200; this has served me well to have good wireless throughout the house (two storeys), however the coverage has never been too great, at least for my purposes: the signal at the back of the house at the ground floor is quite weak and in the back garden we basically have no wifi.

In conjunction with some home building work, I had the chance of laying some network cable in the kitchen/back of the house so I went and bought the Netgear Nighthawk X4S R7800, with the idea of plugging it there in the future.
I have done extensive readings, especially on here, and it seemed to me that even though the Netgear router is not the newest out there, it is still a solid contender!
I do not recall seeing some stats in particular with regards to coverage (I don't think there is such one on the SNB router ranker?), but seeing as it is rated best in a lot of other metrics, I thought to go with this one and that it would offer a strong coverage.

Now that it finally arrived, I run some very simplistic coverage checks. Here is why I am apologising for the triviality of the post, as it is quite far from being scientific!
I basically stood with my phone only (I am aware that to have a stronger real-world test I should probably use at least another device, if not two) in some different points of the house and particularly the garden and recorded the results with the Wi-Fi SweetSpot app.
The router and the powerline adapter are now positioned in the same room, two metres away from each other (if anything the Netgear is closer to the back garden).

I think in all of the outdoor and indoor tests carried out at a certain distance from the devices (when I stand in the same room, coverage is excellent for both, but speed is extremely outstanding for the Netgear!), the TP-Link powerline adapter performed better than the Netgear: if both signals were retrievable, the Tp-link would have marginally better speeds, or otherwise the tp-link would have a very weak signal and the Netgear would have been nowhere to be found.

Surely, I bought the router also because of the additional LAN ports, because (I would imagine that) it can handle multiple devices at the same time without bottlenecking them and because of the option of connecting an USB drive. But maybe seeing as coverage is an issue for me, rather than going out and buying a router (with a future view of getting a second one) and then laying network cables and then going through the hassle of converting them to Access Points, maybe the easiest solution in the first place would have been what I have done till now, powerline adapters!

Does it sound like I had set my expectations too high? Is the Tp-link powerline actually a much better product than I thought it was?
Is coverage something that is broadly speaking quite similar across different devices of different pricetag (but same 802.11 standard?)

I know it is a very vague and un-scientific post, but I hope someone will throw some nice reflection points at me.
Thanks

 

[L&LD]

I have used the following PLA.

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00PVD4318/?tag=snbforums-20

No way do they stand up to even an RT-N12 D1 entry-level router from 2012.

But, each network environment is unique. YMMV and use what you've tested to be best for you.

 

[Going_Strong]

Hi all,

I am aware that this post will be judged as perhaps trivial or quite unfounded.
I hope some will stick with me. Let me make clear from the beginning that I am not a net enthusiast, but for pretty much everything in life, I like to have the best that my budget allows and thus I like to research and understand matters.

I bought a couple of years back a TP-LINK TL-WPA8630P KIT AV1200 Gigabit Powerline Dual Band AC1200; this has served me well to have good wireless throughout the house (two storeys), however the coverage has never been too great, at least for my purposes: the signal at the back of the house at the ground floor is quite weak and in the back garden we basically have no wifi.

In conjunction with some home building work, I had the chance of laying some network cable in the kitchen/back of the house so I went and bought the Netgear Nighthawk X4S R7800, with the idea of plugging it there in the future.
I have done extensive readings, especially on here, and it seemed to me that even though the Netgear router is not the newest out there, it is still a solid contender!
I do not recall seeing some stats in particular with regards to coverage (I don't think there is such one on the SNB router ranker?), but seeing as it is rated best in a lot of other metrics, I thought to go with this one and that it would offer a strong coverage.

Now that it finally arrived, I run some very simplistic coverage checks. Here is why I am apologising for the triviality of the post, as it is quite far from being scientific!
I basically stood with my phone only (I am aware that to have a stronger real-world test I should probably use at least another device, if not two) in some different points of the house and particularly the garden and recorded the results with the Wi-Fi SweetSpot app.
The router and the powerline adapter are now positioned in the same room, two metres away from each other (if anything the Netgear is closer to the back garden).

I think in all of the outdoor and indoor tests carried out at a certain distance from the devices (when I stand in the same room, coverage is excellent for both, but speed is extremely outstanding for the Netgear!), the TP-Link powerline adapter performed better than the Netgear: if both signals were retrievable, the Tp-link would have marginally better speeds, or otherwise the tp-link would have a very weak signal and the Netgear would have been nowhere to be found.

Surely, I bought the router also because of the additional LAN ports, because (I would imagine that) it can handle multiple devices at the same time without bottlenecking them and because of the option of connecting an USB drive. But maybe seeing as coverage is an issue for me, rather than going out and buying a router (with a future view of getting a second one) and then laying network cables and then going through the hassle of converting them to Access Points, maybe the easiest solution in the first place would have been what I have done till now, powerline adapters!

Does it sound like I had set my expectations too high? Is the Tp-link powerline actually a much better product than I thought it was?
Is coverage something that is broadly speaking quite similar across different devices of different pricetag (but same 802.11 standard?)

I know it is a very vague and un-scientific post, but I hope someone will throw some nice reflection points at me.
Thanks

Hi SpaceTofu,

To put a long story short, I'll just say that I've been using the exact same PLC set (two such sets to be exact) in both wired and wireless configurations since around September 2016, and I find their performance, stability and coverage to be as excellent as can be reasonably expected. In any case, they are far, far better (at least in my scenario) than any router used in AP/Repeater mode. YMMV, L&LD.

Both work at one third to one half of nominal speed, however both are installed over two (!) circuit breakers, whereas technically they should be on one and the same circuit (all PLC manufacturers make this requirement).

Tested as flawless with four routers: Asus RT-AC86U, Asus GT-AX11000, TP-Link Archer C4000, and TP-Link Archer C5400X, the only difference being that it was way more difficult to connect them to the Asuses.

Basing on my experience - a top-notch product.

 

[Yehana Mccoy]

The same issue I felt when I brought a new TP-link. There was a connectivity issue. Because I buy that from amazon so return it immediately.

 

[Going_Strong]

The same issue I felt when I brought a new TP-link. There was a connectivity issue. Because I buy that from amazon so return it immediately.

"Connectivity issue" as in "can't connect the PLC to my router" or "can't connect my devices to the PLC"?
Myself, I've had neither problem ...

 

[Trip]

In looking to setup/bolster a network, powerline is about last on the list of tech I would ever consider. This is simply due to the fact that electrical circuitry is not a great medium over which to carry a networking signal. Period. It is not because AV2 adapters can't work, nor that they won't work with likely better throughput and potentially lower latency than wireless -- they certainly can and will do so, as has been evidenced by @Going_Strong and countless others. Rather, it's because the probability of them doing so is entirely dependent on environmental variables that can exist, or not, or change, or not. That makes operational certainty even more of a non-starter than wireless mesh/repeater systems, which, although prone to plenty of interference and poor performance on their own, can at least attain baseline-level operation almost 100% of the time, provided the architecture is designed correctly and the right products are used.

So don't get me wrong; I think it's phenomenal for those who have been able to make powerline work. I mean, what's the harm in trying it, right? If they don't work, you can always do a quick return to Amazon, eBay them, etc. But if you're simply interested in getting your network expansion done right the first time, you need to figure out a proper wired backbone via copper (ethernet, coaxial) or fiber, or a properly setup wireless system.

 

[Going_Strong]

In looking to setup/bolster a network, powerline is about last on the list of tech I would ever consider. This is simply due to the fact that electrical circuitry is not a great medium over which to carry a networking signal. Period. It is not because AV2 adapters can't work, nor that they won't work with likely better throughput and potentially lower latency than wireless -- they certainly can and will do so, as has been evidenced by @Going_Strong and countless others. Rather, it's because the probability of them doing so is entirely dependent on environmental variables that can exist, or not, or change, or not. That makes operational certainty even more of a non-starter than wireless mesh/repeater systems, which, although prone to plenty of interference and poor performance on their own, can at least attain baseline-level operation almost 100% of the time, provided the architecture is designed correctly and the right products are used.

So don't get me wrong; I think it's phenomenal for those who have been able to make powerline work. I mean, what's the harm in trying it, right? If they don't work, you can always do a quick return to Amazon, eBay them, etc. But if you're simply interested in getting your network expansion done right the first time, you need to figure out a proper wired backbone via copper (ethernet, coaxial) or fiber, or a properly setup wireless system.

A wise observation indeed. I would have preferred regular wired connections between my router and clients/APs, but this was not feasible, so I decided on PLC - and I must say I'm not in the least disappointed.
I forgot to mention - and this fact is of paramount importance - that whether or not a PLC will work properly and efficiently in any configuration depends in 80% on the quality of one's electrical wiring. And I'm very fortunate in this regard.

 

[SpaceTofu]

Sorry all I started a conversation and disappeared.
I mentioned the home building renovation we are undergoing and it is unfortunately taking a lot of energies from us.

@L&LD and @Going_Strong , really appreciated your inputs. Indeed it really seems the case that YMMV and by far and large.

@Trip , really appreciated the view on operational certainty. It makes a lot of sense and it goes to show that in our old Victorian house (well, the wiring is obviously a bit more modern than Victorian times), we have been quite lucky with our setup!
But indeed as you mentioned about doing the network expansion right from the onset, as floors are currently ripped up as part of the home work, I will lay a Cat 6e cable so to have the capability of expanding the network later on.

To expand on the PLC / router battle, as I have made an effort in being slightly more conscious.
I have noticed that, not very often, I get a "no internet connection" on the phone; every single time it happened, the phone was connected to the PLC wifi.

Also, I have been using more often Wi-Fi Sweetspots around the house and in the garden and I can say that, in terms of speed:
- being in the office in the same room where the router and PLC are (first floor), Netgear wins hands down, twice as fast regardless if 2.4GHz or 5GHz
- in the garden, standing next to the outside wall where the TP-Link is plugged in on the inside (and one floor up), the 2.4 GHz of the TP-link is as strong as in the office!! No trace of 5 GHz wifis and the Netgear is around 10 Mbps.
- I had a temporary TV antenna next to the Netgear, I unplugged it and physically removed it, but didn't yield to any change
- by our garden patio doors, no signal, even though I can see our office window and the Netgear is sitting on the desk which is just under the window. I then traced an imaginary line and realised the Netgear needed to cross a double brick wall, then 18mm OSB and 20cm of PIR insulation, almost parallel to the roof rather than cross it. Then another 18mm OSB, double skin brick wall with some rockwool insulation sandwiched, before reaching the garden. Same for the TP-Link.

I then moved the Netgear onto the window sill, and I get a (ridiculous) 10 Mbps, even though I can see the office window from the patio doors (not the sill though). At the same time, I can get 10 Mbps from the TP-Link even though it hasn't moved an inch and it has to cut through all of the materials than the Netgear had to cut through!
Walking more to the end of the garden I can get 30/40 Mbps with the Netgear, once the actual router is visible to the eyes.

In short: I still believe the Tp-Link offers a slightly better range
Netgear (unsurprisingly) definitely has a much faster connection and connections seems more stable (it never had an hiccup after a month of usage).

I will probably thus keep the Netgear (even though is unsightly and takes up a lot of space) and sell the Tp-Link.
Once all the kitchen work is done, I will connect another AP to the 6e cable I am going to lay; the end is by the patio door, so I expect/hope that from there I can get a good coverage and speed in the garden.

If anyone has recommendations about a good quality (in terms of coverage and speed) / price ratio AP, much welcomed. I don't need many features at all and it can be PoE.

 

[Trip]

Good to know. With floors/joists/walls open, I would pull double runs of UTP Cat6a to every place you think you may want drops, whether you terminate now or just leave unterminated service loops for later. Home-run everything back to a single managed PoE switch. Oh, and label, label, label!

For an AP on the price-to-performance ratio, it's hard to beat Qualcomm-based TP-Link Omada. The EAP245v3 is excellent for <$100 USD. It can also be software or hardware controller-driven and scaled to multiple APs across the house for blanketed coverage and seamless client roaming.