New House - 3,600 Sqft - Cat6 installed...Wireless Mesh?

[flyersrule]

I need some help getting my new house setup and thought this was the best place.

Moved into a new house that is about 3,600 Sqft. The first floor is rather large with 2 Bedroom, Small Media room (Labeled Study) and giant open spaced living room, dining, kitchen. The 2nd floor is a game room and 2 BR.

Photo of first floor. For reference, that Living room not including kitchen is 17x38x11. The study is 11x16.
https://i.imgur.com/KRtVDbI.gif

2nd Floor - BDR 4 will be Small Office
https://i.imgur.com/BRH9qx4.jpg

I am going to get Comcast 150mb line. For TV we use PSVue Streaming and Netflix 4k

TV's - Placement

• Owner Retreat
• Main Living room against 17ft wall near Owner Retreat
• Study on wall closest to kitchen
• 2nd floor Office

Equipment

• 2 Wireless AVR's - 1 in Study (Media Room)
• 2 Laptops
• Ps4
• Assortment of Amazon and Google Home Devices
• 3-4 Wireless Wyze Cams

I ended up buying these and got an incredible deal at $140 but this week learned my house is setup with Cat 6 in each room. This option looks great but the Satellites dont have ethernet backhaul. The next step up would be the RBK23 with Ethernet Backhaul. The Cat6 Patch Panel is in BR4 on the 2nd floor (My office)

Purchased - $150 - NETGEAR Orbi Wall-Plug Whole Home Mesh WiFi System - WiFi Router and 2 Wall-Plug Satellite Extenders with speeds up to 2.2 Gbps Over 5,000 sq. feet, AC2200 (RBK33)
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B072ZN4PSB/?tag=snbforums-20


Next Step Up - $200-210 After Mover Discount - NETGEAR Orbi Whole Home Mesh WiFi System - WiFi router and 2 satellite extenders with speeds up to 2.2 Gbps over 6,000 sq. feet, AC2200 (RBK23)
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07CQDHPFT/?tag=snbforums-20


I could always just have the Comcast Cable Line come into the Patch Panel, then connect the Main Orbi Hub in the living Room to the Cat 6 Drop, then put a Satellite (non ethernet backhaul version) in the Study for my movies and gaming and one either upstairs or in the Master Bedroom. Maybe that would be fine with 150mb line.

If I do get the upgraded model(RBK23) for $50-60 more here is a potential setup but not sure what would do between modem and hub since the Main Orbi is the router but all cat 6 funnels to the panel https://i.imgur.com/0l5mkrw.jpg

Any thoughts on what to do?

On a side note, I have an older Archer C7 and Archer Ac3200 from my old place. Not sure if I can use them. Maybe as switches

 

[drabisan]

When using a wireless mesh you have to consider every single packet has to travel twice over wireless! That means: everybody stops while I'm receiving the packet from client A; than everybody stops while I'm sending the packet to the central router. And that's the best "star" type of setup, where every node/satellite/insert-name sees the central node directly. There's an even worst scenario - chain. When a satellite sees only a satellite that sees the node.
There is future for this kind of setup, when all central+nodes will be able to use a dedicated wireless backhaul. But it's not here yet at a reasonable price.

If you're looking for any performance, and only for Netflix 4k you have to look at performance, don't get cheap on mesh solution! Best for the buck you'll get by using a wired backhaul. You bought something else and, unfortunately, that' not gonna provide a reliable performance. 2nd option sounds much better, although, after a quick reading, you may need a switch to have both satellites wired.

 

[System Error Message]

Step 1, wire what you can. Mesh is no means for a high bandwidth system if you use a wireless backhaul, wire what you can and the few at the edge that cant be wired would not disturb performance.

Step 2, place as few APs as you can. Place them well instead, you save money too.

Step 3, use powerline to avoid a wireless based mesh, for devices that are only 100Mb/s this will be fine. Use the best powerline you can (AV2000 or better) as speeds are only 10% rated.

step 4, get a router and switch that fulfill your network. Switch should have enough ports for all device, central switch is better but you can distribute switches to reduce cabling. Make sure your router is fast enough for your internet speeds and if it has LACP it can be useful, get semi managed switches if you can too as it gives you more security and monitoring. If you have POE devices go ahead and get a suitable semi managed POE switch.

Step 5, use solid cat5e cables for gigabit network installs, cat6 for 10Gb/s (future) installs up to 50m and cat6a for up to 100m for 10Gb/s. Use CCA cables to wire devices to sockets.

 

[username0475]

I need some help getting my new house setup and thought this was the best place.
...Incredible deal at $140 but this week learned my house is setup with Cat 6 in each room. This option looks great but the Satellites dont have ethernet backhaul. The next step up would be the RBK23 with Ethernet Backhaul. The Cat6 Patch Panel is in BR4 on the 2nd floor (My office)

Purchased - $150 - NETGEAR Orbi Wall-Plug Whole Home Mesh WiFi System - WiFi Router and 2 Wall-Plug Satellite Extenders with speeds up to 2.2 Gbps Over 5,000 sq. feet, AC2200 (RBK33)
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B072ZN4PSB/?tag=snbforums-20


Next Step Up - $200-210 After Mover Discount - NETGEAR Orbi Whole Home Mesh WiFi System - WiFi router and 2 satellite extenders with speeds up to 2.2 Gbps over 6,000 sq. feet, AC2200 (RBK23)
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07CQDHPFT/?tag=snbforums-20


I could always just have the Comcast Cable Line come into the Patch Panel, then connect the Main Orbi Hub in the living Room to the Cat 6 Drop, then put a Satellite (non ethernet backhaul version) in the Study for my movies and gaming and one either upstairs or in the Master Bedroom. Maybe that would be fine with 150mb line.

If I do get the upgraded model(RBK23) for $50-60 more here is a potential setup but not sure what would do between modem and hub since the Main Orbi is the router but all cat 6 funnels to the panel https://i.imgur.com/0l5mkrw.jpg

Any thoughts on what to do?

If you have Cat6 in each room,I'd go with the WIRED backhaul Orbi.
You really don't need to care about positioning Hub since the Cat6 will automatically recongize what's what on the mesh| when hardwired.
Most importantly, there will be no discernable signal degradation where each of those satellites cover when hardwired.

In short, plug the Hub to whereever the cable comes into the house (assuming it's the den) , that it's convenient and doesnt cost anything additonal & the satellites to the Cat6 outlets. The Orbi router will then configure for you.

 

[thiggins]

If you have Cat6 in each room,I'd go with the WIRED backhaul Orbi.

Why? This means you are paying for a third backhaul radio that you are not using.
If using wired backhaul, there is no sense in using a "tri-band" (three radio) mesh point.

 

[flyersrule]

If you have Cat6 in each room,I'd go with the WIRED backhaul Orbi.
You really don't need to care about positioning Hub since the Cat6 will automatically recongize what's what on the mesh| when hardwired.
Most importantly, there will be no discernable signal degradation where each of those satellites cover when hardwired.

In short, plug the Hub to whereever it's convenient & doesnt cost anything additonal & the satellites to the Cat6 outlets. The Orbi router will then configure for you.

Step 1, wire what you can. Mesh is no means for a high bandwidth system if you use a wireless backhaul, wire what you can and the few at the edge that cant be wired would not disturb performance.

Step 2, place as few APs as you can. Place them well instead, you save money too.

Step 3, use powerline to avoid a wireless based mesh, for devices that are only 100Mb/s this will be fine. Use the best powerline you can (AV2000 or better) as speeds are only 10% rated.

step 4, get a router and switch that fulfill your network. Switch should have enough ports for all device, central switch is better but you can distribute switches to reduce cabling. Make sure your router is fast enough for your internet speeds and if it has LACP it can be useful, get semi managed switches if you can too as it gives you more security and monitoring. If you have POE devices go ahead and get a suitable semi managed POE switch.

Step 5, use solid cat5e cables for gigabit network installs, cat6 for 10Gb/s (future) installs up to 50m and cat6a for up to 100m for 10Gb/s. Use CCA cables to wire devices to sockets.

So if I get the Wired Backhaul Version....could I do the following

OPTION 1

2nd Floor Panel - Modem --> Orbi Hub --> Switch

Switch ---- Cat 6 Run 1 ---> Orbi Sat. - Study -> Switch for local devices.

Switch ---- Cat 6 Run 2 ---> Orbi Sat. 2 - Living room or Bedroom-> Switch for local devices.


OPTION 1

Living Room---- Model --> Orbi Hub --> Cat 6 ---> Patch Panal (2nd floor) ---> Switch

Switch ---- Cat 6 ---> Orbi Sat. - Study -> Switch for local devices.

Switch ---- Orbi Sat. 2 (Panel Closet) Bedroom

 

[flyersrule]

Why? This means you are paying for a third backhaul radio that you are not using.
If using wired backhaul, there is no sense in using a "tri-band" (three radio) mesh point.

So what would you consider?

 

[System Error Message]

So if I get the Wired Backhaul Version....could I do the following

OPTION 1

2nd Floor Panel - Modem --> Orbi Hub --> Switch

Switch ---- Cat 6 Run 1 ---> Orbi Sat. - Study -> Switch for local devices.

Switch ---- Cat 6 Run 2 ---> Orbi Sat. 2 - Living room or Bedroom-> Switch for local devices.


OPTION 1

Living Room---- Model --> Orbi Hub --> Cat 6 ---> Patch Panal (2nd floor) ---> Switch

Switch ---- Cat 6 ---> Orbi Sat. - Study -> Switch for local devices.

Switch ---- Orbi Sat. 2 (Panel Closet) Bedroom

you could as long as the orbis are not sharing the same wire as the other switches if you so happen to have local transfers or gigabit internet. So you can connect the orbi to the switch at the edge or the central switch (this one is better) and run multiple cables to each room. PS4 will enjoy ethernet better than wifi. If your LAN needs are less and internet not gigabit, then they can share the same wire to the main switch.

Either setup will work but dont place the wifi in metal closets or enclosed panels, they are claustrophobic and you will see reduced signals. They enjoy being in the center of wide open spaces or the center of where the clients are.

 

[coxhaus]

I would use Ethernet backhaul. Buy wireless equipment to work with an Ethernet backhaul. I would buy Cisco WAP581 wireless units. I don't know if you have the skill to set them up but it is the way I would do it. Run a separate wired only router. This way you can update either without affecting the other. This also frees you to move around the wireless devices for best possible location without worrying about your router location. I think this turns out to be cheaper in the long run.

 

[degrub]

Or most any wireless AC access point or router in AP mode that has good reviews here. You can use POE models with either individual power injectors (check the max power needed - either poe or poe+) or enough POE+ ports on a central switch.

If you need multiple ethernet ports for a room with the AP, just connect a 5 or 8 port gb unmanaged switch to the wall plate and the other devices into the switch. Power injector would go between the switch and the AP. You would not use a POE port on the central swotch in this case.

 

[flyersrule]

Or most any wireless AC access point or router in AP mode that has good reviews here. You can use POE models with either individual power injectors (check the max power needed - either poe or poe+) or enough POE+ ports on a central switch.

If you need multiple ethernet ports for a room with the AP, just connect a 5 or 8 port gb unmanaged switch to the wall plate and the other devices into the switch. Power injector would go between the switch and the AP. You would not use a POE port on the central swotch in this case.

Power Injector? Seems simpler to just get these Orbi's and a switch with them if needs at each AP no?

 

[coxhaus]

I think is simpler to build a proper network to begin with. It will be a lot less frustrating down the road. Networks are getting nothing but more complicated ever year as we add more and more demand to our home networks.

In the end it is the user which suffers.

 

[System Error Message]

I think is simpler to build a proper network to begin with. It will be a lot less frustrating down the road. Networks are getting nothing but more complicated ever year as we add more and more demand to our home networks.

In the end it is the user which suffers.

They've always been simple, but now the managed equipment has gotten cheap and into the house where previously you'd just see unmanaged switches and different mediums and an unreliable router.

Its always good to use managed switches and is a must with POE for safety. Not only do you see stats but you can improve security and with POE you can also see the status of POE, like volts and watts on the port for instance or whether or not it is working.

We also deal with more mediums. Ethernet, Moca, powerline and wifi are common in homes except for Moca but if you dont have it just grab a regular Mocha drink . Additional mediums dont add complexity as they are just mediums, but being able to configure the network is whats considered complicated but well rewarding. There was a video of a teen who bought an old IBM mainframe, you have to configure the IPV4 on that too unlike with modern OSes and firmwares.

 

[coxhaus]

I worked on IBM 370 mainframes for 15 years before the birth of the PC. That kid must be writing assembler. IBM thought everything ran better written in assembler. I even believe OS/2 was first written in C and then converted to assembler to run much faster. The IBM way. IP on an IBM mainframe came at a later date. IBM was SNA all the way.

A 3600 sqft house is going to need several wireless devices. It is a large space to cover. I live in a 3300 sqft house and I lived with an all in 1 router in the old days. I live with a lot of dead air space even using 2.4 Ghz. I was the user that suffered. I now have 3 Cisco wireless devices with very good 5 Ghz coverage. My TV, AppleTV, blueRay, and printer are all on wire so they do not clog my air space. I have airprint which is Apples wireless printing. I still try to keep everything on wire to keep my wireless fast.

 

[flyersrule]

I have 2 TPlink routers (c7 & ac3200) I could also use instead of Orbi.

Upstairs doesn't need to be perfect as it's just my office and a guest room. Most of the time downstairs will be used

Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk

 

[flyersrule]

If you have Cat6 in each room,I'd go with the WIRED backhaul Orbi.
You really don't need to care about positioning Hub since the Cat6 will automatically recongize what's what on the mesh| when hardwired.
Most importantly, there will be no discernable signal degradation where each of those satellites cover when hardwired.

In short, plug the Hub to whereever the cable comes into the house (assuming it's the den) , that it's convenient and doesnt cost anything additonal & the satellites to the Cat6 outlets. The Orbi router will then configure for you.

Scenario 1
I have Comcast coming in this week but I think it comes into the patch panel on in bdr4. So the Orbi hub would go up there with the two hardwired ones in the 1st floor study and either Master bedroom or living room.

Scenario 2
If it comes into the living room, I could attach the hub there then to the cat6 run leading to the patch panel in bdr4.

In the 2nd scenario, if each Orbi satilite has 2 Ethernet ports, could I attach the satilite in the patch panel to the cat 6 leading from living room hub then attach another cat6 cable from the satellite back down to the study where the last satilite will be.

Living Room Modem -> Orbi Hub -> Cat6 leading to upstairs panel -> Orbi Satillite (in panel) -> Cat6 to downstairs -> Orbi Satillite in Study

Or would I need a switch in there

Living Room Modem -> Orbi Hub -> Cat6 leading to upstairs panel -> SWITCH ->Orbi Satillite (in panel) -> Cat6 to downstairs -> Orbi Satillite in Study

Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk

 

[coxhaus]

I would think you would use the patch panel since your house is wired that way. It also sounds like it is going to be a little more difficult for wireless but not to worry as you have wire running all over your house. Terminate your cable in your patch panel. Use a switch to be able to distribute to the wires through out your house. In the living room you may need a small switch since you may have more connections than wires. I have a small switch and I also have one of my wireless APs by my entertainment center since we spend a lot of time there. It also turns out to be a good location for the front of my house to cover my wireless needs. You may want to consider POE switches to power your wireless APs or other devices. There is a difference between POE and POE+ make sure you buy the right ones for your wireless APs. My newer Cisco wireless APs now require POE+. You may find you want POE+ powered cameras or other devices so make sure you plan for it. This is assuming you are using a wired router and a separate distributed wireless system. There is no reason a router should contain a wireless AP in a house this large. It is best not to mount wireless units in closets or cabinets as that degrades their effectiveness especially 5Ghz. I mount my wireless APs high up on the inside walls or on the ceilings. My entertainment center is the exception for mounting the wireless AP. I just blended it in.

I assume the patch panel will support the heat coming off the router, modem, and switch.

 

[username0475]

Scenario 1
I have Comcast coming in this week but I think it comes into the patch panel on in bdr4. So the Orbi hub would go up there with the two hardwired ones in the 1st floor study and either Master bedroom or living room.

Scenario 2
If it comes into the living room, I could attach the hub there then to the cat6 run leading to the patch panel in bdr4.

In the 2nd scenario, if each Orbi satilite has 2 Ethernet ports, could I attach the satilite in the patch panel to the cat 6 leading from living room hub then attach another cat6 cable from the satellite back down to the study where the last satilite will be.

Living Room Modem -> Orbi Hub -> Cat6 leading to upstairs panel -> Orbi Satillite (in panel) -> Cat6 to downstairs -> Orbi Satillite in Study

Or would I need a switch in there

Living Room Modem -> Orbi Hub -> Cat6 leading to upstairs panel -> SWITCH ->Orbi Satillite (in panel) -> Cat6 to downstairs -> Orbi Satillite in Study

Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk

I don't have an orbi but my setup is similar to your in that I have COMCAST + Cat6 in all rooms + I have a hub + 2 satellites - albeit they are a router + 2 wired access points.

My router is in a closet attached to the Telecom patch panel where the Comcast enters the house.
Router is attached to a 8 port PoE switch.
Switch attaches via Cat6 to the 2 wireless AP's mentioned above downstream in distant areas in the house .

I made my recommendation because I equate your Cat6 wiring + orbi 3 pack as essentially same as mine.
My house isn't as big as your @3k sf but I find 3 wireless AP's {router included} is more than enough for me and 1 of those AP's was to get WiFi out to a detached garage 20 ft away from the main house so without that consideration I would have only done the 1 router + 1 addl. AP.

I didn't try repurposing old routers into Access Points since I wanted to try my hand with the wireless AP's (Tp-Link 225v3) recommended here on snb; but basically
that's what your orbi satellites are if you connect them to the Cat6 in your preferred locations.

You can always skip the switch if the orbi satellites don't need it {double check on this} but i find switches are quite useful & ended up expanding beyond just my initial PoE needs {AP's needed the PoE} into streaming video from my PC to my Chromecast at each Cat6 locale .

ps - with the Cat6 in every room, it might behoove you to look into wired AP's as your satellites

 

[Fatawan]

Why? This means you are paying for a third backhaul radio that you are not using.
If using wired backhaul, there is no sense in using a "tri-band" (three radio) mesh point.

Could you elaborate on this? As I understand it, tri-band radios use 2.4, 5.2 and 5.7GHz. Is the 5.7GHz used only for backhaul at this time in tri-band routers because there are no clients to utilize that frequency? Won't clients be coming soon that can use 2.4, 5.2 and 5.7 GHz frequencies?