News Game On for Wi-Fi 6E

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thiggins

Mr. Easy
Staff member
My question is will the WIFI 6 Routers that have been announced but have not come out yet like the Asus AX86U be scrapped and the focus be put on WIFi 6E now?
That's possible. What routers, specifically?
 

Gar

Very Senior Member
I predict the AX86 will be the first 6E unit, I have nothing to base that on though. To the point, why another unit that isn't 6E?
 

Darcy

Senior Member
That's possible. What routers, specifically?
Like the ASUS AX86U I mentioned. I have been interested in that since I first heard about it. I have the AC86U now and like the design and fact I can stand it up.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
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thiggins

Mr. Easy
Staff member
To the point, why another unit that isn't 6E?
Because the average consumer doesn't follow the ins and outs of Wi-Fi that closely and vendors need something new to bring more money in until they can actually ship 6E.
 
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Gar

Very Senior Member
Because the average consumer doesn't follow the ins and outs of Wi-Fi that closely and vendors need something new to bring more money in until they can actually ship 6E.
I think Asus has a good cross section of models as it is. I'd set my sights on 6E anyway. Just me.
 

RMerlin

Asuswrt-Merlin dev
My question is will the WIFI 6 Routers that have been announced but have not come out yet like the Asus AX86U be scrapped and the focus be put on WIFi 6E now?
That depends. Wifi 6E didn't just appear out of nowhere, manufacturers already knew about it (as for instance Broadcom's BCM6755 already lists Wifi 6E support), so it might have been taken into account during development. I guess it depends if they decided to go with it in anticipation of the specs being finalized before the product launch, and also on the validation process. If the device has already been validated by the FCC, then a re-validation would be required to be certified for 6 GHz usage.

So, nobody knows (except the manufacturers themselves).
 

Salles

Regular Contributor
Perhaps this has been answered somewhere else, but what are the benefits of Wifi 6(E), compared with Wifi 5, when you live in a non urban area with perhaps one or no wifi-neighbours?
As I understand 6 Ghz is not faster than 5 Ghz. However, with more devices I can put them on different frequencies. It is a benefit but I do not find it to be worth the price difference unless prices drop in a few years.
What am I missing?
 

L&LD

Part of the Furniture
Because WiFi isn't full duplex, WiFi 6E will be faster.
 

coxhaus

Part of the Furniture
So when we get WIFI 6E there will be the new wireless and the old wireless 2.4 and 5? Do you think the faster speed and low overhead for WIFI 6E is going to push people to replace a lot of there network devices quickly?

What about the phone companies? What impact do you think they will impose on WIFI 6E?
 

L&LD

Part of the Furniture
I think just a new 6GHz. The Tri-band router will become a reality with a product that offers discrete 2.4GHz, 5GHz, and 6GHz radios and separate antennae with AX tech fully implemented and a minimum of 2.5Gbps and better yet, 5Gbps WAN/LAN ports (all of them) to realize that potential the WiFi will offer.

Nobody is ever pushed to replace anything if it is currently working for them. The availability of a newer standard doesn't make current products obsolete.

But for people that want the fastest network possible (and assuming the specific product in question actually delivers), it will be the scratch that satisfies the itch. :)

As a 'free for all' open spectrum band, 6E will have more and more interference as time goes on.
 

RMerlin

Asuswrt-Merlin dev
2.4 GHz isn't going anywhere, because it has greater range, and a lot of manufacturers are cheap and still only support single band.
 

Newfie

Occasional Visitor
I have been reading through the OFCOM report for 6ghz and the proposed changes to the 5ghz DFS channels.
They talk about the 6ghz being great for VR and AR.

https://www.ofcom.org.uk/consultations-and-statements/category-2/improving-spectrum-access-for-wi-fi

will we see restrictions for example on output that differs between different countries as they are now and what do you see as a benefit of using this new standard ie would say an iPhone really require huge amounts of throughput?

if I’ve read OFCOMs report correctly it tends to point that DFS channels may see a benefit which I take it would be and could be implemented in current routers.
 

thiggins

Mr. Easy
Staff member
@Newfie I'm answering your question without reading the report. It's always possible that different regions will set different power levels. Power levels are always a key concern when there are incumbent spectrum users.

6E's only addition to AX is new channels. This will allow for better frequency use planning in large installations. In some cases the additional channels may encourage some network admins to move from 20 to 40 MHz channels.

For home users who love wide channels, the additional channels that don't require DFS radar sensing will make 160 MHz more practical.

Finally, for routers/APs that have dedicated 6GHz radios, spectrum use efficiency should increase because old protocols won't have to be accomodated.

IMO, no, most users don't need Gigabit to their phone.
 

Newfie

Occasional Visitor
Thanks thiggins for answering that. I think OFCOM want to remove the radar part in the U.K. will be interesting to see how it ends up.
 

Newfie

Occasional Visitor
just copied from OFCOMS report. Hope I’ve picked up on the DFS correctly.


Making more efficient use of spectrum in 5725-5850 MHz

1.6 Most channels in the 5 GHz band, including 5725-5850 MHz, are subject to Dynamic Frequency Selection (DFS) requirements. These require Wi-Fi routers to scan for radars while connected and to switch channel if radar transmissions are detected. These requirements were designed to protect radars from interference. However, implementing DFS can add cost to equipment and people using Wi-Fi can be negatively affected by delays to their connection. Additionally, DFS is not required in the 5725-5850 MHz band in other countries where the band is available for licence-exempt use, which further limits the use of this band in the UK as manufacturers must create equipment specific for the UK market.
• We made the 5725-5850 MHz band available for Wi-Fi use in 2017 and said we would keep the regulations under review. Our current analysis indicates that the band is very lightly used by Wi-Fi routers in the UK, which is in part due to the UK-specific requirement to implement DFS in this band, and that the interference risk to radars from indoor Wi-Fi use is very low. We are therefore proposing to remove DFS requirements for indoor use (up to 200mW) only from the 5725-5850 MHz band to increase use of the band and reduce congestion in other channels.
 

thiggins

Mr. Easy
Staff member
5725 to 5820 MHz includes the UN-II-3 channels (149-161). These have never been included in U.S DFS channels.
 

Newfie

Occasional Visitor
I can’t use them in the U.K. either, never had a router capable, the RAX120 does not include the above either which I’m using. Thanks for the clarification.
The only device I’ve seen using that is my Astro A50 headset.

There goes my hopes of making better use of the 5ghz!
 

rmiller1959

Regular Contributor
6E is actually not a new standard. It's just new channels that are available to AX devices only.

This might put a crimp in consumer router sales, which is why manufacturers are going to push to make the transition to 6E as fast as possible.

But then again, most people don't know enough about what they are buying. They see the bigger number on the box and buy it.

Wi-Fi 6 routers should come down in price, with new high-end routers likely to be tri-band 6E.
Before I read the news about Wi-Fi 6E, I was prepared to buy the Netgear Orbi AX6000 tri-band mesh system. My Google Nest Wi-Fi mesh system, which is comprised of all routers (no Nest access points since the specs are lower), works but since I've been working from home exclusively since March 31st, I've noticed slowdowns and a few performance hiccups that made me wonder if I could do better.

The reviews of the Netgear Orbi have been universally strong, although most thought it was too expensive, so I decided to give it a try. I've noticed, however, that 1) the price hasn't dropped one cent, impending new technology aside, and 2) they are sold out at all the major online retailers.

A few months ago, reviewers were saying its performance was amazing but it was too expensive. Now they can't keep the shelves stocked. Is there something going on that I'm not aware of? If my Nest system is adequate, should I wait anyway? Love to hear your thoughts!
 
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thiggins

Mr. Easy
Staff member
What you're seeing is likely the combination of enough people blindly throwing money at a problem (poor Wi-Fi) with supply-line disruption due to Covid-19.

If what you have works well enough, leave it alone. The timeline for new 6E routers will be Q4 this year. Those will likely be top-of-line tri-band models and will be priced accordingly. Unlike current tri-band, which splits the 5 GHz band into two groups of 4 channels (in the U.S.), tri-band 6E will have 2.4, 5 and 6 GHz radios. If you really want best performance for 6E devices when they appear, you'll want tri-band.

Tri-band mesh systems using 6 GHz for backhaul will also appear, but not sure when.
 

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