RT AX86U - Help me improving my latency please! Bufferbloat?

[Tech9]

Load the Merlin firmware and use Cake QOS from the Adaptive QOS tab

Morris, Cake QoS is incompatible with hardware acceleration. It will cut in half his 600/600 ISP line. I don't know what is @miguepram trying to fix. He doesn't need any QOS. Looking at bufferbloat tests at line saturation means nothing. With normal use there is no bufferbloat on 600/600.

 

[L&LD]

openvpn? that's something I have no idea how it works or what it's for. More to read I guess!

Here's all you need to read to get your started with OpenVPN.

Go to the VPN servers tab on the GUI.

Enable the server and leave everything at defaults.

Download the ovpn file to your computer.

Download the OpenVPN client GUI from the link below and install it .

Business VPN For Secure Networking | OpenVPN

OpenVPN is a network security company serving the secure remote access needs of small businesses to the enterprise. Our on-prem and cloud-based products offer the essentials of zero trust network access and are built on the leading OpenVPN tunneling protocol.

openvpn.net

Import the ovpn file you downloaded from the router and connect to your router and network anywhere you have internet access.

 

[bbunge]

openvpn? that's something I have no idea how it works or what it's for. More to read I guess!

You have another option to access your LAN from the internet with iOS and Android devices: Instant Guard. It is under the VPN tab.

 

[Colin Pastuch]

Hey guys, I have the RT-AX86u and I've been struggling to get a clean connection out of my 1000 down 30 up cable connection for almost a year. Typically my down stream increases latency by 200ms average and upstream is equally terrible depending on the time of day. I read this thread, installed Merlin, loaded Cake and BAM massive game changing improvement! Result below.

Bufferbloat and Internet Speed Test - Waveform

View the full results, and test your own bufferbloat

www.waveform.com

Without Cake I get CONSTANT packet burst and packet loss in Warzone, it was so bad I was paying for a second internet connection just to play the game (50/10 DSL). I've had my cable provider out to the house 4 times in the last 6 months and they said they did all they could. The only issue I have with Cake is that I'm only getting 1/3rd of the connection speed I'm paying for. I've tried the Asus Adaptive QOS and it doesn't work at all, I still have all the packet burst and packet loss issues. I also still have crazy latency spikes with the Asus QoS (300ms+).

Should I give FlexQOS a try? Does it work as well as Cake but actually allow hardware acceleration?

I don't understand comments like these:
"But the good news is that you don't need QoS at those speeds either."
"For net 600/600 normally you should not need QoS"

Is this a case where most people can live with a bit of bufferbloat but gamers like me just cant tolerate it? Or is it just that my cable company is horrendous? My cable has been so awful that I'm legitimately afraid to turn off Cake, it's a totally different experience now.

 

[Tech9]

Is this a case where most people can live with a bit of bufferbloat but gamers like me just cant tolerate it?

No. Something is wrong with your cable.

 

[Morris]

Hey guys, I have the RT-AX86u and I've been struggling to get a clean connection out of my 1000 down 30 up cable connection for almost a year. Typically my down stream increases latency by 200ms average and upstream is equally terrible depending on the time of day. I read this thread, installed Merlin, loaded Cake and BAM massive game changing improvement! Result below.

Bufferbloat and Internet Speed Test - Waveform

View the full results, and test your own bufferbloat

www.waveform.com

Without Cake I get CONSTANT packet burst and packet loss in Warzone, it was so bad I was paying for a second internet connection just to play the game (50/10 DSL). I've had my cable provider out to the house 4 times in the last 6 months and they said they did all they could. The only issue I have with Cake is that I'm only getting 1/3rd of the connection speed I'm paying for. I've tried the Asus Adaptive QOS and it doesn't work at all, I still have all the packet burst and packet loss issues. I also still have crazy latency spikes with the Asus QoS (300ms+).

Should I give FlexQOS a try? Does it work as well as Cake but actually allow hardware acceleration?

I don't understand comments like these:
"But the good news is that you don't need QoS at those speeds either."
"For net 600/600 normally you should not need QoS"

Is this a case where most people can live with a bit of bufferbloat but gamers like me just cant tolerate it? Or is it just that my cable company is horrendous? My cable has been so awful that I'm legitimately afraid to turn off Cake, it's a totally different experience now.

Flex QOS is additional turning for Adaptive QOS so it will not help.

Your issue is the slow uplink speed is resultign in the flooding the interface and causing packet loss. This is what Cake is designed to do. You are correct that turning off hardware acceleration which is required for cake is limiting your download speed. Most people don't need 1-Gb down. The most bandwidth demanding thing most people do is stream 4K video which requires up to 25-Mb per device (stream). Count the maximum number of TVs + Computers that will stream 4K video at the same time and multiply by 25-Mb. Add a cushion of 25-Mb or more and this is the size download link you need. If that fits within the 300-Mb you get with cake turned on you might consider reducing the speed of your link to save funds. The only downside of being limited to 300-Mb or less is that some downloads will take longer. My family is super happy on a 100/100 link with Cake QOS. If you need more than the 300-Mb download, you will need to invest in a much more capable router that runs Cake QOS.

Morris

 

[Xrsenal]

Well, I just finished doing all the hard reset process that you have recommended, along with the reinstallation of the latest fw merlin available.

After the reset I have simply configured the basic data to have internet, without touching anything else and I have repeated the tests, this time with the laptop's integrated gigabit adapter.

Without changes. Latency still appears in the download phase: https://www.waveform.com/tools/bufferbloat?test-id=93252f0d-980d-4331-8856-68fdaed63e8a

Maybe yes, it's normal, but one thing I don't like is that in the internal speed test of the AX89U (speedtest.net) I always get better results (+ -30mbps in download and ... + -300 !!! in upload) Is this normal? Same server of course. Perhaps it is true that the problems come from the computer.

Speaking of cables, a couple of days ago I was testing different cables, some cat 5, and the results were always the same and always in the same ranges.

Changing the subject, is there any guide out there to configure the router in the best possible way in detail? I have seen the second link that you put me above but I see it more focused on wifi and it really is what worries me the least because I usually have everything wired although I have followed some of your advice that I have read out there such as assigning a fixed channel and the rest. Things like open ports, upnp, etc. I have always put a fixed IP to the game console in the DMZ but I think this is not recommended for security reasons. Better to activate UPNP?

Having the NAS (configured with access from an external network) and the PS5 on the same network, won't compatibility problems arise if both devices ask the router to open the same port at the same time? Some time ago I saw that both (my nas is a Synology ds418play by the way) had ports in common.

In this particular case, how is it better to manage the port opening thing? PS5 over DMZ and UPNP active, PS5 without DMZ and UPNP active, manual portforwarding, do I turn off nas when playing PS5?

Thanks for everything! You deserve a beer from me! Better 2 or 3 of course!

the ax86u has a gaming port for your console ; ive done numerous testing and idk it just feels weird af

 

[rlj2]

Good afternoon!

First of all i want to say sorry for my english because it isnt my native language.

As the title says, I would like to ask your advice to improve the latency of my connection.
I have decided to change the router + ONT HGU GPT-2541GNAC of my ISP (Movistar Spain) precisely because of latency problems. I read that it was a not very powerful router and that it could give bufferbloat problems so I bought an ONT UFIBER Nano G and an Asus RT-AX86U.

With the HGU in dslreports I received very low marks, with the bufferbloat graph always in the red zone. The ping in online games (COD CW and Warzone) was always around 60-70ms at least. This has changed with the AX86U. Now I have a pin beteen 35-45ms. I thought they were more than acceptable results and I couldn't improve any more, but by surprise in the waveform test I see that I have an average download latency of 20-30 ms. The upload is usually 1ms and the idle latency about 10ms on average.

Are these results normal? I have seen people test with 1 ms both in download and upload and I would like to try to achieve this. I hope someone can advise me. Could be ISP related problems or router config?

I have installed the latest merlin in the asus and the flexqos plugin, but the truth is that I have no idea how to configure the qos and others. I imagine that the key will be here, in knowing how to configure them, because I have tried to do it with the qos turned on in adaptive and gaming mode and the results are worse.

I leave you results of the speed tests. All the tests are done with the QOS turned off and all the equipment is wired with CAT 8. The tests are done on a laptop with i7, 16gb of ram and SSD, connected by a USB 3.0 gigabit network adapter. At the time of testing, the only thing that is connected is the laptop itself.

The scheme would be the following ISP FIBER (Movistar Spain 600/600 symmetrical) - ONT Ufiber (bridge mode) - AX86U - 3.0 usb UGREEN gigabit adapter - Laptop

Speed test result

I tested my connection at DSLReports.com/speedtest ..

www.dslreports.com

Bufferbloat and Internet Speed Test - Waveform

View the full results, and test your own bufferbloat

www.waveform.com

I'm going to do a factory reset to the router and wait to see what you tell me! Thanks in advance!!!!

I change back and forth between a AX86 and AC86 as the main router. Nothing (besides using cake) fixes bufferbloat on the AX86. I get C or D bufferbloat on dsl reports with the AX, the AC gets A+ with same settings..

 

[L&LD]

You may want to forget the same old 'same settings' then? And see what actually works on the new router.

 

[rlj2]

You may want to forget the same old 'same settings' then? And see what actually works on the new router.

No settings work for bufferbloat on the AX, its not rocket science. Adjust manual bandwidth.

 

[L&LD]

No bufferbloat here.

 

[leerees]

Are you sure your line is 1000/30? No wonder you get bufferbloat.

Change your line for something normal. Your upload should be at least 20% of your download.

 

[torstein]

Hmm, here's mine on AX58 (latest merlin) on 5Ghz radio streaming to a macbook pro 3x3 AC and 1000/1000 connection. It does vary between grade A and a B on multiple test runs. And sometimes my latency is 30-40ms on unloaded. I can't explain it.

Is it normal that the faster the connection, the more bufferbloat there will be, naturally? Due to the connection being so fast and the router working hard to push all the data downlink?

Or what exactly is causing bufferbloat?

 

[Tech9]

s it normal that the faster the connection, the more bufferbloat there will be, naturally?

It happens when your internal network is faster than your ISP, at ISP line saturation speeds. Don't pay too much attention to bufferbloat tests online. They stress your ISP line and show the worst case scenario you may never experience in real life Internet use.

 

[Tech9]

Are you sure your line is 1000/30? No wonder you get bufferbloat.

Normal for Rogers cable in Canada using DOCSIS 3.0 equipment. The modems they send to subscribers are as cheap as possible. Often there is no other choice, 1000/30 is the best you can get. Bell is offering up to so called Gigabit Fibe 1.5 (1500/940), subject to availability. Not available in many places. My own home ISP line is 500/30 cable, but no heavy uploaders and no bufferbloat issues.

 

[Xrsenal]

It happens when your internal network is faster than your ISP, at ISP line saturation speeds. Don't pay too much attention to bufferbloat tests online. They stress your ISP line and show the worst case scenario you may never experience in real life Internet use.

Ok I guess I’ll go grab proof to prove their is QoS behind the port. I just have no clue what type that’s why I asked Merlin.

I’ll do my own testing and proof but I’ll tell you this.

I played against a group of streamers in a best out of 3 wager.

First game I used the gaming port. Their ping was 58-63 STABLE barely moving on my host.

Next game I switched to the 2.5 port , and their ping was spiking from 58-76-58-70-80 all around like crazy.

 

[leerees]

Normal for Rogers cable in Canada using DOCSIS 3.0 equipment. The modems they send to subscribers are as cheap as possible. Often there is no other choice, 1000/30 is the best you can get. Bell is offering up to so called Gigabit Fibe 1.5 (1500/940), subject to availability. Not available in many places. My own home ISP line is 500/30 cable, but no heavy uploaders and no bufferbloat issues.

Ditch any ISP that uses cable modems. They are known for packet loss and buffer bloat, not to mention the increased latency from the modems themselves. A lot of cable ISP's use traffic shaping and huge contention ratios to make up for the shortcomings of the technology. You should always get fibre to the home.

 

[MarkyPancake]

Normal for Rogers cable in Canada using DOCSIS 3.0 equipment. The modems they send to subscribers are as cheap as possible. Often there is no other choice, 1000/30 is the best you can get. Bell is offering up to so called Gigabit Fibe 1.5 (1500/940), subject to availability. Not available in many places. My own home ISP line is 500/30 cable, but no heavy uploaders and no bufferbloat issues.

Same problem here in the UK with Virgin Media fibre (DOCSIS). Their services' upload are 10% of the download.

Ditch any ISP that uses cable modems. They are known for packet loss and buffer bloat, not to mention the increased latency from the modems themselves. A lot of cable ISP's use traffic shaping and huge contention ratios to make up for the shortcomings of the technology. You should always get fibre to the home.

Where we live, the only fibre option currently is Virgin Media (DOCSIS) and none of the non-DOCSIS providers offer download speeds anywhere near what VM do, so we're stuck for now, as we need the bandwidth to deal with the amount of devices homeworking, streaming, gaming, etc. When/If we get better non-DOCSIS broadband in our area, I would like to give it a try, particularly for the gaming side of it, as it would be nice to have as low latency as possible.

 

[Tech9]

Ditch any ISP that uses cable modems.

Did you read my entire post?

 

[leerees]

Same problem here in the UK with Virgin Media fibre (DOCSIS). Their services' upload are 10% of the download.



Where we live, the only fibre option currently is Virgin Media (DOCSIS) and none of the non-DOCSIS providers offer download speeds anywhere near what VM do, so we're stuck for now, as we need the bandwidth to deal with the amount of devices homeworking, streaming, gaming, etc. When/If we get better non-DOCSIS broadband in our area, I would like to give it a try, particularly for the gaming side of it, as it would be nice to have as low latency as possible.

I feel your pain with VM, I was stuck with them for years. For latency, BT is the best. Vodafone FTTH is also good. I'm in central London and waiting for either Voda or BT. At present I am paying far too much to a "community" fibre company.