Access points buying advise

[pauljbl]

I looking at second hand enterprise access points

I have the ruckus r500 in mind.

Does anyone have experience with the Aruba IAP 205

 

[coxhaus]

I would think an enterprise AP would be a very dependable system with lots of handles to turn for fine tuning.

 

[Trip]

Aruba is solid stuff. Radios aren't quite on the level of Ruckus or high-end Aironet, but it has its advantages in other areas like software and access layer integration. Comparatively, Ruckus is lacking there, but that stuff matters much less for a budget/home deployment, where your switching can often be any brand of solid-enough gear and it doesn't need fancy single-pane-of-glass integration. On the controller side as well, you'll almost always be fine with non-server-grade, non-cloud; either embedded or a small appliance. With Aruba, that would be Aruba Instant or a refurb/working-pull 7005, whose base license includes up to 16APs, more than enough for practically any home/SOHO install.

That said, I still prefer Ruckus for the quality of their client connections and their interference mitigation, both of which seem to "just work" and don't need nearly as much tinkering. I'd look at either a low number of R500's or 510's, or maybe a single R710, which gives roughly 15-30% more usable range and 5-10% better interference mitigation, plus no roaming needed if a single one is enough. For a controller, considering you want the most seamless roaming, I would go ZoneDirector, as it's more feature-rich and fully-baked than Unleashed. ZD1200's on eBay are starting to fall in price.

 

[pauljbl]

Do you think the zd1100 would be good enough for the r500

 

[Trip]

Absolutely, especially given how cheap the combo is for the results you get. Almost laughable at this point. Definitely the "sleeper" buy right now. Don't tell too many people.

EDIT: You of course can only run up to 9.10.x.x code base on the 1100, but honestly, it's so mature and stable, that until there is are KRACK-level exploits that start going unpatched, you'll be fine for another few years to come, at least. *knock on wood!*

 

[pauljbl]

Have you experience with the Aruba IAP 205 I ask about this one as seen some going cheap

 

[Trip]

Yeah, the 205's are decent. Not quite as much usable range per radio versus an R500, though. Even an R310 will often equal it, as well.

 

[pauljbl]

I think I am worried what will give best roaming hand offs?

Would the range on the r500 be as good as your older ruckus system?

 

[Trip]

I would give the edge to Ruckus, running off the ZoneDirector code base. And the ZD1100 will work fine. A 1200 running on v. 10+ code will add stability refinements for newer APs, but overall roaming behavior should be close, if not identical.

I'd throw Aironet into the mix (4800 APs and a 2500/3500 controller) but the cost is eye-gouging for a SOHO setup, and potentially no better for roaming, save for maybe certain Apple clients (given their partnership with Cisco a few years ago). I've yet to see much literature confirming anything there, though.

 

[pauljbl]

Is the range on your ruckus better than a r500

 

[Trip]

Yes, but that's because it's the top-end series with a larger radio array, both per radio and total number of elements. I have the 7982 (N-class), which was replaced by the R700 (identical accept AC class), then replaced by the R710, 720, 730 and 750. Here's the latest product guide:
https://webresources.ruckuswireless.com/pdf/product-info/ruckus-product-guide.pdf

 

[pauljbl]

I see
Have you ever tested VoIP calls roaming with your ruckus setup?

 

[Trip]

Yes. I've roamed on Android 7.0 and 9.0 phones and a Windows 10 Pro tablet, all running ZoiPer connected to VoiP.ms <30ms away, and never a problem. And this is with one of my two 7982's connected via mesh backhaul, as well. I'm running the latest ZD 9.10.x.x firmware on a ZD1100. Very occasionally, they'll be a quick, sub-second blip when walking around, but it's so infrequent that it's hard to tell if it's the wifi, softphone or network issues upstream (ISP, VoIP.ms's POTS conversion, etc.).

Apart from wifi, it's important to remember quality elsewhere. I run commercial patch/cabling brands, my switching is HPE (enterprise QoS capable), I have an EdgeRouter 4 as a gateway (bye bye bufferbloat) and a Broadcom-based SB6183 cable modem (no Intel Puma 6). So I've removed as much flakiness from access layer to WAN as reasonably possible for a home setup. For anyone wanting to run really smooth soft-client VoIP at home, similar measures should be taken. (Many here would view commercial patch cords and enterprise switches as overkill, but I still prefer both)

 

[coxhaus]

I notice nobody ever claims roaming with an iPhone. It is always with an Android. It is hard to believe all network guys use Androids.

I would also think the density would be higher on the commercial wireless over the consumer level gear. How many connections and active connections does the Ruckus support?

 

[pauljbl]

What's the fastest speed you've gotten with 2.4ghz. I can never get over 100mbp if standing next to ap

 

[coxhaus]

I see 144.4Mbp on 2.4Ghz. But I turned off b/g and only defined 802.11n on my Cisco wireless APs.

I am now trying to understand my roaming since I turned off band steering. I can now see my back AP on a low level 2.4Ghz. I guess STP is doing some kind of blocking on dual access. I may have to adjust power levels.

 

[Trip]

What's the fastest speed you've gotten with 2.4ghz. I can never get over 100mbp if standing next to ap

Typical max with 300Mb/s dual-chain N will be 130-150Mb/s reported, 100Mb/s or so transfer rate real-world. If you're close to that with whatever gear you have, you're likely not going to do much better with a 2x2 station and client on 2.4Ghz, regardless the hardware/software running the show.

I notice nobody ever claims roaming with an iPhone. It is always with an Android. It is hard to believe all network guys use Androids. I would also think the density would be higher on the commercial wireless over the consumer level gear. How many connections and active connections does the Ruckus support?

Nah, of course not. There has to be somebody out there whose done this with iPhones/iPads. I just happen to fall into the Android camp. As far as Ruckus maximum associated clients and active connections goes, here's the current product guide for their APs:
https://webresources.ruckuswireless.com/pdf/product-info/ruckus-product-guide.pdf
They list that metric as "Users". I presume one "user" equates to a single and active client association. Maximum users ranges from 100 on the entry-level APs to 1024 on the R730 and R750. In my real-world experience, it's usually 60 to 80% of that number; still fairly impressive, all things considered.

 

[coxhaus]

I believe concurrent users is allowed connections but active users is probably lower per radio. Much better than your run of the mill wireless routers. It could even be better than the Cisco small business wireless APs. I think you get 200 connections and 128 active users per AP in the Cisco small business world.

What does "IoT ready" mean? Is it just marketing crap. What difference does it make whether you run across wireless of not?

 

[Trip]

I think you get 200 connections and 128 active users per AP in the Cisco small business world.

They do list a max of 64 per radio on the 500 series APs. I would think for much more than 100 or so active clients routinely you'd need an Aironet-based solution if you wanted to stay with Cisco.

What does "IoT ready" mean? Is it just marketing crap. What difference does it make whether you run across wireless of not?

A marketing term, usually, but with Ruckus it actually signifies which APs will accept one of their IoT modules, which allow for BLE, Zigbee and LoRa connectivity for IoT endpoints that don't have onboard wifi.

EDIT - Corrected.

 

[coxhaus]

Cisco lists per radio so your 64 per 2.4Ghz and 64 per 5Ghz so it is 128 per AP as I stated. The setting for allowed connections in my Cisco AP is 200 but you can set it lower. The settings are 0-200. I don't know why you would want 0 maybe if you are scanning for rogue APs. The Cisco APs can be set to scan for rogue APs.

PS
Do any of those IoT device for Ruckus extend the Blue tooth for Apple? I just installed Eve energy switch for remote switching of devices in my house. They run through Apple blue tooth not wireless.