Frontier fiber internet - Can I build a Moca LAN

Good Life

New Around Here
Hello Everyone,

Currently I have Frontier fiber internet, and use coax connection. The ONT box is located outside the house, and the technician put a Frontier FCA251 MoCA adapter in the ONT.

In my study room, coax cable from my wall Jack connect to another Frontier Moca adapter, and then use ethernet cable from the other end of the Moca adapter to router WAN port.

My question is: can I build a Moca LAN? Currently the router is in my study room. I have another 3 rooms, and all of the rooms has pre-wired coax cable. Can I get additional Moca adapter, so I can convert all of the rooms pre-wired coax wiring to ethernet connection, then I can use ethernet cables to connect to my computer ? In another words, I don't need to use wireless connection in other rooms?

Before Frontier, I used Spectrum internet service. I bought Hitron & ScreenBeam Moca adapters in other rooms to build a Moca LAN and there are no problems. However, this time I try to use these 2 adapters but it did not work.

Should I get particular brand adapter?

Thanks in advance for your help.
 

degrub

Very Senior Member
very likely. Search this subforum for "FCA251" . There several threads and reference links for how to use .
 

krkaufman

Very Senior Member
My question is: can I build a Moca LAN?
Yes, but because your WAN connection is over MoCA via the FCA251 adapters, you’ll likely need to use FCA251 adapters (with the configuration switch toggled to a compatible setting), rather than retail adapters, to effect two MoCA networks over the same coax. However odd, this setup would require two MoCA adapters at your router location, one bridging your WAN connection from the ONT, and the 2nd bridging your router LAN over your coax.

Can you report back with the current configuration toggle setting for your WAN FCA251 adapters?

FWIW, here’s the operating frequencies for each setting, copied from a goCoax forum thread (which was taken from the FCA251 user guide):

the WF-803FT Quick Start Guide offers the following details on "WAN" and "LAN" operation of the WF-803FT:
  • WAN (1475-1675 MHz); 2x 100 MHz
  • LAN (1025-1350 MHz); 3x 100 MHz
  • FULL (1125-1675 MHz); 5x 100 MHz

So retail adapters *could* be used provided they are configured in sync with (not overlapping) whatever setting is chosen for the FCA251 MoCA WAN link, “LAN” or “WAN.”

edit: p.s. Note that the dual MoCA networks must share the MoCA spectrum, so the throughput for each MoCA 2.5 network is reduced from the theoretical maximum based on how many channels are employed for the link, with each channel offering up to 400 Mbps shared throughput. Basically, you can run 2 MoCA networks, but throughput will align closer to bonded MoCA 2.0 rather than MoCA 2.5.
 
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krkaufman

Very Senior Member
My question is: can I build a Moca LAN?
Rather than running two MoCA networks, is there some way that you can isolate the WAN link from the LAN, allowing max throughput for both … and allowing plug-and-play reuse of your existing adapters?

Is there any room that has dual coax runs from the central junction? Could a coax or Ethernet run be added? Do adjacent rooms have coax outlets where you could DIY a coax or Ethernet connection through the shared wall to creatively establish a dual path?
 
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Good Life

New Around Here
Yes, but because your WAN connection is over MoCA via the FCA251 adapters, you’ll likely need to use FCA251 adapters (with the configuration switch toggled to a compatible setting), rather than retail adapters, to effect two MoCA networks over the same coax. However odd, this setup would require two MoCA adapters at your router location, one bridging your WAN connection from the ONT, and the 2nd bridging your router LAN over your coax.

Can you report back with the current configuration toggle setting for your WAN FCA251 adapters?

FWIW, here’s the operating frequencies for each setting, copied from a goCoax forum thread (which was taken from the FCA251 user guide):



So retail adapters *could* be used provided they are configured in sync with (not overlapping) whatever setting is chosen for the FCA251 MoCA WAN link, “LAN” or “WAN.”

edit: p.s. Note that the dual MoCA networks must share the MoCA spectrum, so the throughput for each MoCA 2.5 network is reduced from the theoretical maximum based on how many channels are employed for the link, with each channel offering up to 400 Mbps shared throughput. Basically, you can run 2 MoCA networks, but throughput will align closer to bonded MoCA 2.0 rather than MoCA 2.5.
Hello ;

Thanks for the detailed explanation. I will try to get additional FCA251 to test. Currently, my WAN is connected ethernet cable via FCA251. The router ( Arris NVG468MQ ) Coax function is disable now. I am doubt if I get the FCA251 adapter and installed to another rooms coax jack, the MoCA network will work?

My current configuration toggle setting is 'WAN" for both adapters, one is located in ONT box, another one is located behind router.

Thanks.
 

krkaufman

Very Senior Member
I am doubt if I get the FCA251 adapter and installed to another rooms coax jack, the MoCA network will work?
I can’t understand this sentence/question.

oh, by the way, see this auction as an alternative, should its “Make Offer” option be an improvement over whatever other source(s) you may have: eBay FCA251/WF-803FT
 

krkaufman

Very Senior Member
My current configuration toggle setting is 'WAN" for both adapters, one is located in ONT box, another one is located behind router.
Ok, so that means you have 800 Mbps throughput shared for your WAN link, based on the configuration info from the FCA251 user guide:
WAN (1475-1675 MHz); 2x 100 MHz​
LAN (1025-1350 MHz); 3x 100 MHz​
FULL (1125-1675 MHz); 5x 100 MHz​
(2x MoCA 2.x channels at 400 Mbps per channel = 800 Mbps)

Given the “WAN” configuration of the current 2 FCA251 adapters, you should be able to add some FCA251 adapters set to “LAN” to establish a MoCA LAN over the same coax, with the MoCA LAN having 1200 Mbps shared throughput (from 3x MoCA 2.x channels).

Alternatively, prior to ordering the “LAN” FCA251 adapters, you could experiment with your prior retail adapters to see if they can be configured to function strictly below the MoCA WAN frequency range. (Consult the respective vendors for configuration details.)
 

Good Life

New Around Here
I can’t understand this sentence/question.

oh, by the way, see this auction as an alternative, should its “Make Offer” option be an improvement over whatever other source(s) you may have: eBay FCA251/WF-803FT
Another question: if WF-803FT MoCa 2.5 Ethernet Network Adapter is plug & play ( if I toggle to LAN position) ?

My router ( Arris NVG468MQ ) currently is connected to WAN port via ethernet cable, so the router's coax function is disable now. As my understanding, if the router's coax is not function, then the signal will not go to other room's coax jack. That is why I doubt if I install a WF-803FT MoCa 2.5 adapter on another room, then I can use my computer go to internet?

Again, very appreciated your help.
 

krkaufman

Very Senior Member
Another question: if WF-803FT MoCa 2.5 Ethernet Network Adapter is plug & play ( if I toggle to LAN position) ?
That is my understanding and experience, and the benefit of the physical configuration toggle switch ... rather than having to access the configuration UI to manually tweak the settings to adjust the operating frequency range. (The configuration toggle should only be flipped when the adapter is powered-off.)

My router ( Arris NVG468MQ ) currently is connected to WAN port via ethernet cable, so the router's coax function is disable now.
Well, the NVG468MQ has no MoCA WAN functionality; it only accepts a WAN connection via its Ethernet WAN port. The coax port on the NVG468MQ is for its built-in standard MoCA 2.0 LAN bridge (400 Mbps), so you'll want to keep the NVG468MQ disconnected from your coax, to keep it from interfering in your MoCA setup. (Because the NVG468MQ can't be configured to coexist with the FCA251 MoCA "WAN" setup.) Probably best to cap the NVG568MQ's coax port with a 75-ohm terminator as a reminder to not ever connect it to your coax.

As my understanding, if the router's coax is not function, then the signal will not go to other room's coax jack. That is why I doubt if I install a WF-803FT MoCa 2.5 adapter on another room, then I can use my computer go to internet?
Correct, which is the basis for my earlier comment, easily missed amongst all the blathering:
However odd, this setup would require two MoCA adapters at your router location, one bridging your WAN connection from the ONT, and the 2nd bridging your router LAN over your coax.
You'll need to add one FCA251/WF-803FT MoCA adapter set to "LAN" at the router location, linked via Ethernet to a LAN port on the NVG468MQ (and your coax outlet, of course), and then any remote FCA251 "LAN" adapters should be able to connect through it, to your router and the Internet.
 

Good Life

New Around Here
That is my understanding and experience, and the benefit of the physical configuration toggle switch ... rather than having to access the configuration UI to manually tweak the settings to adjust the operating frequency range. (The configuration toggle should only be flipped when the adapter is powered-off.)


Well, the NVG468MQ has no MoCA WAN functionality; it only accepts a WAN connection via its Ethernet WAN port. The coax port on the NVG468MQ is for its built-in standard MoCA 2.0 LAN bridge (400 Mbps), so you'll want to keep the NVG468MQ disconnected from your coax, to keep it from interfering in your MoCA setup. (Because the NVG468MQ can't be configured to coexist with the FCA251 MoCA "WAN" setup.) Probably best to cap the NVG568MQ's coax port with a 75-ohm terminator as a reminder to not ever connect it to your coax.


Correct, which is the basis for my earlier comment, easily missed amongst all the blathering:
You'll need to add one FCA251/WF-803FT MoCA adapter set to "LAN" at the router location, linked via Ethernet to a LAN port on the NVG468MQ (and your coax outlet, of course), and then any remote FCA251 "LAN" adapters should be able to connect through it, to your router and the Internet.
First of all, thanks for your time and explanation. Because I am not a technology guy, please allow me to ask more questions: you said " You'll need to add one FCA251/WF-803FT MoCA adapter set to "LAN" at the router location..... " , does that mean I need to get a 2-way cable splitter first, and the 1st output-end connect to the FCA251 which is linked to WAN port via ethernet cable, and 2nd output-end connect to another FCA251 which is toggle as "LAN" and linked to NVG468MQ LAN port?
 

krkaufman

Very Senior Member
I need to get a 2-way cable splitter first, and the 1st output-end connect to the FCA251 which is linked to WAN port via ethernet cable, and 2nd output-end connect to another FCA251 which is toggle as "LAN" and linked to NVG468MQ LAN port?
Yes, correct.

(edit: semi-related prior post from Reddit here; Frontier has just simplified the setup described in the Reddit post by offering MoCA adapters with physical toggle switches to set the LAN and WAN operating mode — though using alternative, non-standard frequency ranges)

Recommended “designed for MoCA 2.x” splitter series:
 
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Good Life

New Around Here
Yes, correct.

(edit: semi-related prior post from Reddit here; Frontier has just simplified the setup described in the Reddit post by offering MoCA adapters with physical toggle switches to set the LAN and WAN operating mode — though using alternative, non-standard frequency ranges)

Recommended “designed for MoCA 2.x” splitter series:
Updated:

I bought 1 of 2-way splitter ( Antronix MMC1002H-B ), and installed it as above description. Yes, it works !! The MoCA LAN works !! However, when I run speed test, the average speed is only about 90/90; it's far below my Wi-Fi tested speed 300 Mbps, and my internet plan is 500/500. Is there something wrong of my setting?

Also, I try to use a GE digital 4-way splitter but it did not work; even I only connect WAN port via ethernet cable, my computer cannot use internet. Is it because I used 4-way splitter instead of 2 -way?

Thanks.
 

degrub

Very Senior Member
That GE is set up for satellite, not MOCA. Just because it covers the frequency range does not mean it will work with MOCA. It may, but in most cases it will not.

Run IPERF to test the local LAN over MOCA. Log into the adapters and verify what the sync speed is and post. Also post your IPERF results.
 

krkaufman

Very Senior Member
when I run speed test, the average speed is only about 90/90;
First suspicion whenever I see speed test numbers just under 100 Mbps is that there’s a Fast Ethernet bottleneck somewhere.

Are you testing using a GigE-capable PC/laptop hard-wired?

You may want to check the network cables to confirm that they’re all working properly. (An 8-wire Cat5+ cable can go a little bad, just bad enough that the network link negotiated drops to 100 Mbps.)
 

Good Life

New Around Here
That GE is set up for satellite, not MOCA. Just because it covers the frequency range does not mean it will work with MOCA. It may, but in most cases it will not.

Run IPERF to test the local LAN over MOCA. Log into the adapters and verify what the sync speed is and post. Also post your IPERF results.
Oh~ GE is not MOCA .... no wonder it doesn't work. I got it, thank you.
 

Good Life

New Around Here
First suspicion whenever I see speed test numbers just under 100 Mbps is that there’s a Fast Ethernet bottleneck somewhere.

Are you testing using a GigE-capable PC/laptop hard-wired?

You may want to check the network cables to confirm that they’re all working properly. (An 8-wire Cat5+ cable can go a little bad, just bad enough that the network link negotiated drops to 100 Mbps.)
OK, I will try different cable. Thank you.
 

krkaufman

Very Senior Member
OK, I will try different cable. Thank you.
Could be any number of things, but checking cables is a good idea. Ideally, you’d be able to check the link status for your various Ethernet connections, to see if they’re linking at Gigabit (1.0 Gbps) or Fast Ethernet (100 Mbps), to locate the bottleneck.
 

krkaufman

Very Senior Member
The MoCA LAN works !! However, when I run speed test, the average speed is only about 90/90; it's far below my Wi-Fi tested speed 300 Mbps, and my internet plan is 500/500. Is there something wrong of my setting?
Any progress/resolution on this?
 

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